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Federal Employees: You be the Judge
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Rank: Newbie
Groups: Registered
Joined: 11/9/2018(UTC) Posts: 7 
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I was removed due to lack of candor after 6 years of being a federal employee. An anomaly occurred in my life from June to Sept. i acted out of character and was not truthful about attending school in order to conduct a shift swap to remain on day shift. I provided my employer with a class schedule that I didnt create but knew was not legit. One thing led to another an investigation was done in which I admitted to to the wrongdoing 18 mins into the interview and was later removed in December. Can I get back into the government with this hanging over my head? Any suggestions on how to overcome this? In the 6 years I’ve never had any disciplinary actions or problems until as I said events took place in my life that I wasn’t able to handle and thought I could fix my personal life by staying on day shift so I provided a document that wasn’t legit.
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Rank: Senior Member
Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/24/2014(UTC) Posts: 526
Thanks: 201 times Was thanked: 123 time(s) in 104 post(s)
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Originally Posted by: Danigirl20  I was removed due to lack of candor after 6 years of being a federal employee...removed in December. I'm so sorry to hear this - I know this is hindsight, but you should have been represented by an attorney. Did you file in the MSPB? Due to the time issue, you may have lost your rights to fight this removal - my advice is to find an attorney to discuss the options. Perhaps your removal can be changed to a resignation. I really don't know though because I am not an attorney and don't know the specifics of your case. Originally Posted by: Danigirl20  Can I get back into the government with this hanging over my head? Yes, you can. Anything is possible with God. God Bless.
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Rank: Newbie
Groups: Registered
Joined: 11/9/2018(UTC) Posts: 7 
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Thank you all for your responses! Should I upload and include my current SF-50 which shows removal lack of candor when applying for jobs on USAJobs?
DroneBee- I am not represented by an attorney however I have submitted my case to MSPB and in the begging stages. The timelines were extended because of the shutdown. The union I was apart of is representing me.
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Rank: Groupie
Groups: Registered
Joined: 9/4/2014(UTC) Posts: 78  Location: Hawaii Thanks: 9 times Was thanked: 41 time(s) in 32 post(s)
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I don't see it happening right away. Get a job anywhere, as soon as you can, and then, you will have better references. You may get back, but you are battling a crowd, and you have quite a load. Also, a hiring manager will just think that there was much more to the story.
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Rank: Senior Member
Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/24/2014(UTC) Posts: 526
Thanks: 201 times Was thanked: 123 time(s) in 104 post(s)
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Originally Posted by: Danigirl20  Should I upload and include my current SF-50 which shows removal lack of candor when applying for jobs on USAJobs? If you apply for jobs as an outsider (Delegating Examining Unit (DEU) which means that the federal job posting can be applied by any American citizen) then you don't have to attach your SF-50. Originally Posted by: Danigirl20  DroneBee- I am not represented by an attorney however I have submitted my case to MSPB and in the begging stages. The timelines were extended because of the shutdown. The union I was apart of is representing me. Good! You filed in the MSPB, which is your only real option. I'm glad that the union will represent you - going through the MSPB can be daunting and lengthy. God Bless.
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Rank: Senior Member
Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/8/2008(UTC) Posts: 5,619
Thanks: 103 times Was thanked: 1106 time(s) in 879 post(s)
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Originally Posted by: DroneBee  Originally Posted by: Danigirl20  Should I upload and include my current SF-50 which shows removal lack of candor when applying for jobs on USAJobs? If you apply for jobs as an outsider (Delegating Examining Unit (DEU) which means that the federal job posting can be applied by any American citizen) then you don't have to attach your SF-50. But it will show up at the clearance/suitability part of the hiring process...and the offer could be rescinded at that point. The lack of candor appears to be the easiest thing to charge. Providing a fake document to remain on a specific shift may be very problematic for anyone seeking a clearance. Originally Posted by: DroneBee  Originally Posted by: Danigirl20  DroneBee- I am not represented by an attorney however I have submitted my case to MSPB and in the begging stages. The timelines were extended because of the shutdown. The union I was apart of is representing me. Good! You filed in the MSPB, which is your only real option. I'm glad that the union will represent you - going through the MSPB can be daunting and lengthy. God Bless. If the MSPB overturns the removal, you will have better luck finding a position. That said, I'd recommend (as others have) to find a non-federal position for a few years to put some time between the action that led to your removal and seeking federal employment again. Time is a great mitigator. Not perfect...but it can help if there are no other issues since then. Edited by user Monday, February 25, 2019 4:41:48 AM(UTC)
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You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
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Rank: Member
Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/22/2016(UTC) Posts: 15 
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Can anyone explain why Danigirl could be fired for one incident? (granted, a serious one). I thought there was still a process the government had to go through to fire someone, i.e. counsel, give a chance to correct the problem, etc. Is it because it could be considered a crime (although pretty minor on the crime scale)? Interested in the legalities around this.
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Rank: Senior Member
Groups: Registered
Joined: 12/22/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,282
Thanks: 108 times Was thanked: 300 time(s) in 262 post(s)
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Originally Posted by: ObiOne  Can anyone explain why Danigirl could be fired for one incident? (granted, a serious one). I thought there was still a process the government had to go through to fire someone, i.e. counsel, give a chance to correct the problem, etc. Is it because it could be considered a crime (although pretty minor on the crime scale)? Interested in the legalities around this. Progressive disciple means using the minimal level of discipline to correct the misconduct, not the lowest level available (unless the agency has agreed to something else). When the misconduct is serious enough, the first action may be the last. Lack of Candor, as Danigirl describes, is serious enough to go for a removal. |
The excuse of, "I read it on FederalSoup..." won't work. Please do your due diligence. |
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Rank: Advisor
Groups: Registered
Joined: 12/29/2012(UTC) Posts: 134
Thanks: 1 times Was thanked: 38 time(s) in 30 post(s)
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Originally Posted by: ObiOne  Can anyone explain why Danigirl could be fired for one incident? (granted, a serious one). I thought there was still a process the government had to go through to fire someone, i.e. counsel, give a chance to correct the problem, etc. Is it because it could be considered a crime (although pretty minor on the crime scale)? Interested in the legalities around this. In this case, it may have been the admission that did the employee in. Trying to clean it up later would mean contradicting herself, which raises questions about her credibility. I don't see the "severity" of the charge being an issue here, as we all know SCORES of federal employees who have done much worse and not received so much as a slap on the wrist, let alone discipline/removal.
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Rank: Senior Member
Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/8/2008(UTC) Posts: 5,619
Thanks: 103 times Was thanked: 1106 time(s) in 879 post(s)
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Originally Posted by: nightchop  Originally Posted by: ObiOne  Can anyone explain why Danigirl could be fired for one incident? (granted, a serious one). I thought there was still a process the government had to go through to fire someone, i.e. counsel, give a chance to correct the problem, etc. Is it because it could be considered a crime (although pretty minor on the crime scale)? Interested in the legalities around this. In this case, it may have been the admission that did the employee in. Trying to clean it up later would mean contradicting herself, which raises questions about her credibility. I don't see the "severity" of the charge being an issue here, as we all know SCORES of federal employees who have done much worse and not received so much as a slap on the wrist, let alone discipline/removal. The admission may actually have helped. If they discovered she was lying in the investigation as well, then the outcome may have been worse. In the Douglas Factors, coming clean can be a mitigating factor, but it may not overcome the the negatives that exist. |
You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
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Rank: Advisor
Groups: Registered
Joined: 12/29/2012(UTC) Posts: 134
Thanks: 1 times Was thanked: 38 time(s) in 30 post(s)
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"Can be" is the operative phrase. It is a risk, and one I would advise most employees not to take unless there is clear and convincing, and damn near irrefutable evidence you did something wrong. Never apologize to the agency and certainly don't commit such in writing. And why should you? The agency will run like hell with a lie, even when there is ample evidence proving their agents' wrongdoing. In circus court your apology might help if by some miracle you end up with a decision maker who is truly objective. Doubtful, because at the point you are facing termination the action has been greenlit at every level. But if you insist on being a hopeless optimist, sure, go ahead and take a huge gamble. Good luck in real court.
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