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Relocating

Are you considering relocating your federal career - either by your choice or by Uncle Sam? There are practical issues and concerns to think about when deciding whether or not to relocate. Others have done it while still others have not. This forum will allow for all to offer their insight, post their questions, and help each other out.

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DoD_IT-Guy  
#1 Posted : Wednesday, January 6, 2021 7:36:49 AM(UTC)
DoD_IT-Guy

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Good afternoon, all. I'm trying to obtain some information regarding accepting a promotion while stationed OCONUS that would relocate me back to CONUS. Before I dive into the details, I need to preface that I have not been in this particular situation before, and it's also a new one for the HR representative that is helping me through the process. I do NOT currently have a firm offer. Only a tentative one.

Situation: I am a GS-12 stationed in Germany. I recently applied and was selected for a GS-13 position located in CONUS with my current agency (the same department I'm currently in). I have return rights with a transportation agreement to my previous agency in CONUS that is in a different state than the new position. The new position was advertised with no relocation expenses authorized.

A former coworker that was in a similar situation told me that if I accept the promotion, it will nullify my current transportation agreement, and I will be forced to cover my own PCS from Germany to the CONUS duty station.

My questions:

1. Is it true that it would nullify my currently authorized PCS entitlement back to CONUS? Even if my orders were amended to change the destination from my old HOR to the new duty station?

2. The hiring officials are currently on-board with me remaining in Germany until the end of my current tour, and then PCS'ing to the new duty location. The job can be performed from my current location. This is based on the assumption that my current transportation agreement will cover the relocation. Is this correct?

3. In the event accepting the promotion DOES nullify my transportation agreement/PCS authorization, can the agency authorize the relocation expenses in the firm offer? Or are they required to readvertise the position stating relocation expenses are authorized?

I realize these questions are somewhat contradictory, but any advice or regulatory references that I should specifically look at would be tremendously helpful. This way I can work with HR from a knowledgable standpoint. Right now I'm buried in OPM fact sheets and guides trying to find the answer.

Thank you in advance!
SpaceBall  
#2 Posted : Wednesday, January 6, 2021 10:35:39 AM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: DoD_IT-Guy Go to Quoted Post
Good afternoon, all. I'm trying to obtain some information regarding accepting a promotion while stationed OCONUS that would relocate me back to CONUS. Before I dive into the details, I need to preface that I have not been in this particular situation before, and it's also a new one for the HR representative that is helping me through the process. I do NOT currently have a firm offer. Only a tentative one.

Situation: I am a GS-12 stationed in Germany. I recently applied and was selected for a GS-13 position located in CONUS with my current agency (the same department I'm currently in). I have return rights with a transportation agreement to my previous agency in CONUS that is in a different state than the new position. The new position was advertised with no relocation expenses authorized.

A former coworker that was in a similar situation told me that if I accept the promotion, it will nullify my current transportation agreement, and I will be forced to cover my own PCS from Germany to the CONUS duty station.

My questions:

1. Is it true that it would nullify my currently authorized PCS entitlement back to CONUS? Even if my orders were amended to change the destination from my old HOR to the new duty station?

2. The hiring officials are currently on-board with me remaining in Germany until the end of my current tour, and then PCS'ing to the new duty location. The job can be performed from my current location. This is based on the assumption that my current transportation agreement will cover the relocation. Is this correct?

3. In the event accepting the promotion DOES nullify my transportation agreement/PCS authorization, can the agency authorize the relocation expenses in the firm offer? Or are they required to readvertise the position stating relocation expenses are authorized?

I realize these questions are somewhat contradictory, but any advice or regulatory references that I should specifically look at would be tremendously helpful. This way I can work with HR from a knowledgable standpoint. Right now I'm buried in OPM fact sheets and guides trying to find the answer.

Thank you in advance!


I suggest you open up the JTR (Joint Travel Regulations), that is where you will find these answers.

https://www.defensetrave...mil/Docs/perdiem/JTR.pdf

Start at section: 0537 ELIGIBILITY, then keep reading.

Another important section: 053705. Government Interest, and keep reading.

I have a lot of experience with this, so I do not want to give you an answer I do not have for your particular case. Each time this occurs, it is strictly a case-by-case basis. What you will read is agencies have a lot of flexibility for what they can do, however they are under no obligation to do so.
djp  
#3 Posted : Friday, January 8, 2021 3:38:47 PM(UTC)

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A few questions....

For clarity..

Location A is original location
Lication B is where you are current
Location C is new job lication

Is A job and Zi job under same agency?

How e exactly did you get location B? Apply for it from an internal announcement or leadership ask of people wanting to get deployed

Does the job carry win set term with relocation to AND from?

Do you have return rights to location A job? Remember return rights means you don’t get the same job but a similar job upon return. In the same series but not ne essarily in the same office you came from.

In returning, what is different in locations? Assuming everything else is fine...you were deployed from San Diego naval base the new job is at Norfolk naval base. It might be a cheap cost to go to Norfolk than San Diego so Thry coukd modify. If it was reversed they could be willing to cover the costs back to Norfolk but you have to pay to get the stuff to San Diego



TheUnderverse15  
#4 Posted : Saturday, January 9, 2021 12:05:47 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: djp Go to Quoted Post

Do you have return rights to location A job? Remember return rights means you don’t get the same job but a similar job upon return. In the same series but not ne essarily in the same office you came from.



I dont know about that part, because most of the time the return rights paperwork list exact job and position that is being held for you. Most advertisements for return rights job that opens when you leave states "obligated position" which person will return to and remove TERM employee that is in your return rights position. Usually PPP is the way you described it. PPP doesnt guarantee you your exact job, doesnt have to be in the same series.
SpaceBall  
#5 Posted : Friday, January 15, 2021 1:07:12 PM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: TheUnderverse15 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: djp Go to Quoted Post

Do you have return rights to location A job? Remember return rights means you don’t get the same job but a similar job upon return. In the same series but not ne essarily in the same office you came from.



I dont know about that part, because most of the time the return rights paperwork list exact job and position that is being held for you. Most advertisements for return rights job that opens when you leave states "obligated position" which person will return to and remove TERM employee that is in your return rights position. Usually PPP is the way you described it. PPP doesnt guarantee you your exact job, doesnt have to be in the same series.


I can confirm what TheUnderverse15 wrote above, as I am in the process of going back overseas again, and HR told my supervisor exactly that.

FatHappyCat  
#6 Posted : Friday, January 15, 2021 2:06:53 PM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: DoD_IT-Guy Go to Quoted Post


My questions:

1. Is it true that it would nullify my currently authorized PCS entitlement back to CONUS? Even if my orders were amended to change the destination from my old HOR to the new duty station?

2. The hiring officials are currently on-board with me remaining in Germany until the end of my current tour, and then PCS'ing to the new duty location. The job can be performed from my current location. This is based on the assumption that my current transportation agreement will cover the relocation. Is this correct?

3. In the event accepting the promotion DOES nullify my transportation agreement/PCS authorization, can the agency authorize the relocation expenses in the firm offer? Or are they required to readvertise the position stating relocation expenses are authorized?



So the general rule from the JTR for most people is this, assuming you have a transportation agreement:

1 - if you stay less than a year, you’re on your own getting back

2- if you stay more than 1, but less than 2, the command has the option of funding your way back.

3- if you stay more than 2, they are required to send you back depending on the nature of your return. If you exercise ppp or return rights, command must pay to the new location regardless of where it is. If you resign, command sends you back to HOR. (Realistically, they’ll send you back to the almost anywhere in the us unless you’re trying to get to some exotic location such as outside conus.

With that in mind...

1 - your transportation agreement directs where you can PCS, but as mentioning, as long as you’ve done your 2 and you’re not going to some far-fetched location, you should be ok.

2 - most orders are usually good for 6 months or until the fy ends. You can probably delay it for some time, but not indefinitely. However, this is not a good idea. First you lose all your entitlements, lqa, cola, all sofa support such as gas, govt furniture, commissary, etc. second you also do not get locality pay unless you’re actually in the local area. (To get technical, to get locality pay you must physically be, or be able to be, at the location 2 days every pay period) you’d basically lose all your overseas benefit and support.

3 - that’s between u and your agency. I don’t think it’ll have to be reposted, but pcs are expensive and outside of the usual depts, like state or dod, it almost never happen. Even if it does, it’s usuually the, giving you a check and telling u to figure it out.

Good luck.
TheUnderverse15  
#7 Posted : Saturday, January 16, 2021 4:48:47 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: SpaceBall Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: TheUnderverse15 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: djp Go to Quoted Post

Do you have return rights to location A job? Remember return rights means you don’t get the same job but a similar job upon return. In the same series but not ne essarily in the same office you came from.



I dont know about that part, because most of the time the return rights paperwork list exact job and position that is being held for you. Most advertisements for return rights job that opens when you leave states "obligated position" which person will return to and remove TERM employee that is in your return rights position. Usually PPP is the way you described it. PPP doesnt guarantee you your exact job, doesnt have to be in the same series.


I can confirm what TheUnderverse15 wrote above, as I am in the process of going back overseas again, and HR told my supervisor exactly that.




Thanks Spaceballs,

Going through little different process, trying to renounce my rights for new position I got CONUS. Usually in your return rights paperwork, it has the exact job and title that belongs to you. And with RM/G8/N8/A8...manning docs has who is exactly in which position.
TheUnderverse15  
#8 Posted : Saturday, January 16, 2021 4:52:43 AM(UTC)
TheUnderverse15

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Originally Posted by: FatHappyCat Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: DoD_IT-Guy Go to Quoted Post


My questions:

1. Is it true that it would nullify my currently authorized PCS entitlement back to CONUS? Even if my orders were amended to change the destination from my old HOR to the new duty station?

2. The hiring officials are currently on-board with me remaining in Germany until the end of my current tour, and then PCS'ing to the new duty location. The job can be performed from my current location. This is based on the assumption that my current transportation agreement will cover the relocation. Is this correct?

3. In the event accepting the promotion DOES nullify my transportation agreement/PCS authorization, can the agency authorize the relocation expenses in the firm offer? Or are they required to readvertise the position stating relocation expenses are authorized?



So the general rule from the JTR for most people is this, assuming you have a transportation agreement:

1 - if you stay less than a year, you’re on your own getting back

2- if you stay more than 1, but less than 2, the command has the option of funding your way back.

3- if you stay more than 2, they are required to send you back depending on the nature of your return. If you exercise ppp or return rights, command must pay to the new location regardless of where it is. If you resign, command sends you back to HOR. (Realistically, they’ll send you back to the almost anywhere in the us unless you’re trying to get to some exotic location such as outside conus.

With that in mind...

1 - your transportation agreement directs where you can PCS, but as mentioning, as long as you’ve done your 2 and you’re not going to some far-fetched location, you should be ok.

2 - most orders are usually good for 6 months or until the fy ends. You can probably delay it for some time, but not indefinitely. However, this is not a good idea. First you lose all your entitlements, lqa, cola, all sofa support such as gas, govt furniture, commissary, etc. second you also do not get locality pay unless you’re actually in the local area. (To get technical, to get locality pay you must physically be, or be able to be, at the location 2 days every pay period) you’d basically lose all your overseas benefit and support.

3 - that’s between u and your agency. I don’t think it’ll have to be reposted, but pcs are expensive and outside of the usual depts, like state or dod, it almost never happen. Even if it does, it’s usuually the, giving you a check and telling u to figure it out.

Good luck.



#3 - Going through this situation now. PCS to closer location than HOR. Asking losing command for PCS to closer area, which is a promotion. Due to lack of budget in most agencies, most are denying incentives too. Sometimes you can work it out with agencies to give bonus or payback later. My last agencies helped me out by giving me broken quarterly bonuses to make up for being rushed to my current position.

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