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Information Security

Information security can mean protecting information and information systems from unauthorized access, use, disclosure, disruption, modification or destruction. This goes beyond just computers and networks. Risks and threats can come from individuals, acts of nature, and new technology.

This topic affects everyone in the federal workforce - top to bottom. Thus, it is also the responsibility of everyone in the federal workforce to protect the information from threats.

Share your experience with securing information.

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truotsuko  
#41 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 7:51:42 AM(UTC)

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Listen totj, you make very valid points but I fear you once
again misunderstood me, never once did I try to pass WGU of as the premier
institution in the country I believe I actually said comparing it to some other
brick and mortar schools is akin to comparing a bicycle to the space shuttle.
All I have ever said and continued to say is that the IA program the school
offers is not, as you put it, crap simply because they chose to teach CCNA at
the Masters level of an IA program. You made my point for me by saying "Most
of IA simply comprises getting systems compliant and standardized on a baseline
vetted security postures and implementing policies and controls which keep them
there once mitigations are discovered. They implement and audit such information
systems for baseline compliance and consistency. They review the policies
written by the CISSP's that ultimately establish the IA framework, and review
this in a regular system development lifecycle to constantly refine and implement further controls on a needed basis."

As it relates to getting a real masters degree from Carnegie Mellon, or
Syracuse University, I live and work in Korea so right now my choices are
limited regarding Masters programs, of the schools available to me University
of Maryland was the only other online institute that had its IA program also
accredited by the NSA and I do not want to go to University of Maryland. It
does however bear mentioning that both schools you listed also have their IA programs accredited by the NSA (http://www.nsa.gov/ia/academic_outreach/iace_program/iace_certified_institutions.shtml#pa)
and (http://www.nsa.gov/ia/academic_outreach/iace_program/iace_certified_institutions.shtml#ne).
I ask you other than what we have been discussing in this forum, what have you
done to further your knowledge of their IA program (WGU that is), because you
rally against them with some degree of passion and I would like to know where
it stems from. Online Universities will most likely never compete at the same
level as traditional brick and mortar schools, but it is at least comforting,
IMO, that before they simply give you a degree they have you take industry
certs which legitimizes the knowledge you say you have, and they also have
traditional University classes. But it is hard to strike a balance between
traditional learning and true proof of knowledge. I love certifications that
challenge me, I would love it if they offered CISM, CISA, or even CAP for that matter but who knows that may be coming down the pike.

Having said all that because the university is a not-for-profit they keep costs
low, there are not that many schools that have ALL the necessary accreditations that you can get a Masters from for under $10,000.



truotsuko  
#42 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 7:57:41 AM(UTC)

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I should also mention that you would not automatically gain any of the certifications simply by attending, you would actually have to go to either a prometric or pearson vue testing site and schedule your exam, once you pass they verify your score with the certifying vendor. All they do is provide you with the tools (books, curriculum, homework, term papers, and the like) that help you prepare to take the certification exam. It is no different than you doing it by self study, except that if you have questions there are instructors and fellow students that you can ask to clarify a concept you do not fully grasp.

truotsuko  
#43 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 9:55:47 AM(UTC)

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Listen WGU is not the best school in the country by far, but
it is not what you think it is, do not take my word for it but please take the time and review the following links.
http://www.detc.org/accred.html (Distance Education and Training Council)


http://www.nwccu.org/Directory%20of%20Inst/Alpha%20Cluster/w_z.html  (Northwest Commission on Colleges and Universities)
http://www.ncate.org/tabid/177/Default.aspx?ch=106&state=ut (National Council for the Accreditation of Teacher Education)
http://www.aacn.nche.edu/CCNE/reports/rptAccreditedPrograms_New.asp?state=UT&sFullName=Utah (CCNE-Accredited Nursing Degree Programs)
http://www.cahiim.org/accredpgms.asp
(Commission on Accreditation for Health Informatics and Information Management Education)
http://www.nsa.gov/ia/academic_outreach/iace_program/iace_certified_institutions.shtml#ut (National Security Agency)
http://ope.ed.gov/accreditation/SearchResult.aspx?6d6f64653d5365617263684279496e737469747574696f6e267264743d372f31382f3230313120393a30323a303420504d (Department of Education)


The point I am trying to make is simply because you have
your personal feelings about an institution does not mean that you are
automatically right, I would take the word of, Department of Education, the
NSA, and every accrediting body in the continental United States over a blogger
on Federal Soup any day, please do your research next time when you want to write on topics with some semblance of accuracy.



totj  
#44 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 11:41:46 AM(UTC)

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You do understand that certs dont make the person, right? More to the point, NSA accreditation doesnt speak to the quality of the graduates.

Im familiar with WGU. 

If you want to pursue certs then self study. If you want an education, pursue a quality (or better than WGU) University. You dont have to go to the crem de la crem Universities. But you dont have to go to diploma mill for-profits either.

Certification achievement is vastly different than obtaining an education - especially at the masters level. This was brought up back on page 4 of this thread.

And no one really cares about NSA accreditation. A CCNA/CCNP Security cert fulfills certain NSA standards, but is not like Cisco networking academy goes around touting NSA NSA NSA NSA.
http://www.cisco.com/web/learning/le3/le2/le0/le1/learning_certification_type_home.html

Relax man. Im not picking on you. Im just telling you not to merge two distinct career options. I dont really care what you do. Im writing these posts so that other people who find this thread dont get the wrong, and more importantly, unbalanced information.

truotsuko  
#45 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 12:06:28 PM(UTC)

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I have actually followed a number of your posts and I have to say you come across as intelligent that is why I was shocked when you wrote something off without researching it.
Where do I start,
"If you want to pursue certs then self study. If you want an education, pursue a quality (or better than WGU) University. You don’t have to go to the crème de la crème Universities. But you don’t have to go to diploma mill for-profits either."

 
WGU is a not for profit, and has been accredited so to call it a diploma mill simply because you feel so is "misleading and unbalanced information"

A simple search of the Department of Education’s website (http://www2.ed.gov/students/prep/college/diplomamills/diploma-mills.html) Defines Diploma mill as such.

“DIPLOMA MILL- The term `diploma mill' means an entity that--
(A)(i) offers, for a fee, degrees, diplomas, or certificates, that may be used to represent to the general public that the individual possessing such a degree, diploma, or certificate has completed a program of postsecondary education or training; and (ii) requires such individual to complete little or no education or coursework to obtain such degree, diploma, or certificate; and
(B) lacks accreditation by an accrediting agency or association that is recognized as an accrediting agency or association of institutions of higher education (as such term is defined in section 102) by--
(i) the Secretary pursuant to subpart 2 of part H of title IV; or (ii) a Federal agency, State government, or other organization or association that recognizes accrediting agencies or associations.”

Now I have shown you that the school is accredited by all accrediting agencies, also by the Department of Education, so by the definition of the Department of Education, I am sorry to say but you have no clue what you are talking about.

Now as previously stated you appear to be an intelligent person, so please do your research and ask yourself why all these accrediting agencies do not satisfy your requirement, as I said earlier you are entitled to your opinion but not your own set of facts, please drop this because you have not listed one credible source (other than your brain) that supports your argument, I on the other hand have listed several sources not only credible sources but legitimate organizations that accredit universities all over the United States accept reality, you are way out of your depth on this one.

truotsuko2011-07-18 20:14:27
totj  
#46 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 10:13:04 PM(UTC)

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truotsuko wrote:


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I have actually followed a number of your posts and I have to say you come across as intelligent that is why I was shocked when you wrote something off without researching it.
Where do I start,
"If you want to pursue certs then self study. If you want an education, pursue a quality (or better than WGU) University. You don’t have to go to the crème de la crème Universities. But you don’t have to go to diploma mill for-profits either."

 
WGU is a not for profit, and has been accredited so to call it a diploma mill simply because you feel so is "misleading and unbalanced information"

A simple search of the Department of Education’s website (http://www2.ed.gov/students/prep/college/diplomamills/diploma-mills.html) Defines Diploma mill as such.

“DIPLOMA MILL- The term `diploma mill' means an entity that--
(A)(i) offers, for a fee, degrees, diplomas, or certificates, that may be used to represent to the general public that the individual possessing such a degree, diploma, or certificate has completed a program of postsecondary education or training; and (ii) requires such individual to complete little or no education or coursework to obtain such degree, diploma, or certificate; and
(B) lacks accreditation by an accrediting agency or association that is recognized as an accrediting agency or association of institutions of higher education (as such term is defined in section 102) by--
(i) the Secretary pursuant to subpart 2 of part H of title IV; or (ii) a Federal agency, State government, or other organization or association that recognizes accrediting agencies or associations.”

Now I have shown you that the school is accredited by all accrediting agencies, also by the Department of Education, so by the definition of the Department of Education, I am sorry to say but you have no clue what you are talking about.

Now as previously stated you appear to be an intelligent person, so please do your research and ask yourself why all these accrediting agencies do not satisfy your requirement, as I said earlier you are entitled to your opinion but not your own set of facts, please drop this because you have not listed one credible source (other than your brain) that supports your argument, I on the other hand have listed several sources not only credible sources but legitimate organizations that accredit universities all over the United States accept reality, you are way out of your depth on this one.



Dear God please stop. You dont have the first clue how to understand what in the world you are reading.

WGU is ran by a board of governors 15/20 which are Republicans, and also financially backed and sustained by a myriad of corporations to include: AT&T, Dell, Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation, Lumina Foundation for Education, Sun Microsystems, HCA, HP, Microsoft, Qwest, American Express, Simmons Media Group and Zions Bank. Yea, who would have guessed a Republican created school would be ran by Fortune 100 corporations...

There is no minimum high school grade point average for admission, and no minimum score on the SAT or ACT.

WGU has competency-based programs for completing their degree and certificate
requirements, with no requirement of class attendance. Competency-based
programs allow students to demonstrate through assessments that they
have acquired the set of competencies (levels of knowledge, skill, or ability) required for a particular degree or certificate.

GTFO of here with your bull*****. WGU is a corporate diploma mill thats doing nothing but devaluing the spirit and integrity of what it means to have a Masters Degree. The school is a joke.

You first started out trying to tell us all that it has every regional accreditation, and had to, because it was nationally accredited. Now youre saying its not a diploma mill because it doesnt meet all of the requirements for the definition of a diploma mill by the Dept of Education. You have no idea what youre trying to talk about here. Dont even think about coming at me with a claim of failing to research anything...
totj2011-07-19 06:18:44
truotsuko  
#47 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 10:25:42 PM(UTC)

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Listen totj just because an institution of higher learning does not meet what you define as a school does not discredit it. Now you have to note that it was formed by a bipartisan group of governors the plurality of which just happened to be Republican, now I do not think anyone in their right mind would call Bill Gates a Republican but that is neither hear nor there. All I am saying and continue to say is that you are basing your assumptions of WGU solely on personal bias, if the University has all required accreditation's (the same that are required of Harvard) whether you choose to accept it or not is of no consequence the DOE has and that in the United States of America is what deems a school as credible. Listen as I have said a million times, the school by no means compares to Harvard or Yale, but its programs in the eyes of all agencies that accredit schools both government and non governmental meet the standard of education, I get the feeling that unless Jesus Christ (or insert your belief system of choice here) comes down and tells you that it is a decent school your biases will not let you see past that.
Now I have asked before and I will ask again cite one credible source other than your personal feelings that says it is not a reputable institution and I will bow, other than that you are simply rambling and inserting your personal beliefs in what ought to be an informational blog. Once and for all the school is legitimate in the eyes of all that count except yours, what more proof do you need?
hustonj  
#48 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 10:32:46 PM(UTC)
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Liceline?  Is that you?  It sounds like you.  That's a shame.
truotsuko  
#49 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 10:33:42 PM(UTC)

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And for the record when I was corrected that a National accreditation did not mean it had all the regional accreditations required, I bowed out but it just so happens that WGU is Regionally accredited in every region but logs its accreditation in its home Region; so while yes my ignorance in the accrediting of universities gave you a point it only helped to further mine, the school is regionally accredited across the USA (except in the mind of totj). Look I do not want to personally deride you, because frankly speaking I do not know you, but please if you want to discredit something cite anything other than your gut feeling because that is not constructive to a true debate. truotsuko2011-07-19 06:53:36
truotsuko  
#50 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 10:35:37 PM(UTC)

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hustonj wrote:
Liceline?  Is that you?  It sounds like you.  That's a shame.
I do not think you were refering to me, but if you were I have not once and never will use anyother moniker than truotsuko
truotsuko  
#51 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 11:00:35 PM(UTC)

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I am still waiting for your source, and please let it be backed by any of the recognized accrediting agencies to include but not limited to the United States Department of Education; you have made it clear that you do not like their approach to higher learning, but I think that the word of every agency I cited carries more weight than yours. Long and short do not deal with the school at all because you do not like their approach, but to claim that they are a diploma mill is simply misleading and false. Please tell me other than what you believe what standards of education are you willing to accept, because you obviously do not accept anything that is legitimate in the United States of America and note I said legitimate because they ALL have accepted the University but you. Come on as I said you appear to be an intelligent individual, can you let this particular battle go as you cannot counter anything that the Department of Education, or any of the not for profit accrediting agencies have laid out as educational standards. Now if you want to argue that the standards are too lax because they WGU was so easily able to meet them, that is a separate argument, but now the more you write you are seeming like an educational idealog, which is fine but please base all your assertions on facts not feelings.

But I do not expect that you will be willing to accept facts as they are laid to you because you are too entrenched in your position, but I think it bears mentioning that I did say that traditional brick and mortar schools will always have an advantage over distance learning, but to discredit one simply on your say so is ludacris, you are not the Secretary of Education.

 

totj  
#52 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 11:43:47 PM(UTC)

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You clearly dont have the capacity to understand what is being said.

Have fun at WGU and enjoy wasting your money at a frivolous University, regardless of what medium they teach through.

WGU is a joke, as is are the schools like it backed by corporations and give people academic credit for "life experience" with no minimum academic standards - and given your superficial understanding of the topic at hand, perhaps its not such a bad school for you after all.

Again, enjoy your time at the school of your choice.

totj2011-07-19 07:51:04
truotsuko  
#53 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 11:50:36 PM(UTC)

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Thank you for finally accepting that you are basing everything you have said in pure fantasy, not in the reality that everyone else bases theirs. I continue to ask, if you have such bad feelings towards the school what are you basing it one other than personal feelings; you cannot provide me one credible source to back your assertions but you call the school a joke. If you say it is a joke please define and cite your assertions backed with facts, not only feelings.

I would prefer if you state one organization with credible sources that backs your assertions about the school being a joke because so far all you have are personal feelings.

truotsuko  
#54 Posted : Monday, July 18, 2011 11:52:40 PM(UTC)

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The school does not give credit for life experience as you say, they actually state that if you know the course material take the test pass it and get credit for the course, to me that makes sense and saves money...
truotsuko  
#55 Posted : Tuesday, July 19, 2011 12:11:50 AM(UTC)

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Look I have already told you based on your certifications and degree, you are well credentialed to work in your field, but please for the love of God cite one credible source that backs what you claim because if you don’t, all you have written so far is a colossal waste of time and energy, get to the point cite one, I have cited numerous of which I note you have not challenged.

SF18C  
#56 Posted : Tuesday, July 19, 2011 2:27:29 AM(UTC)

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hey look at me I can pee up a rope farther than you...this sure has been an entertaining thread!

Kim Rivers  
#57 Posted : Tuesday, July 19, 2011 2:48:45 AM(UTC)
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totj wrote:

You clearly dont have the capacity to understand what is being said. Have fun at WGU and enjoy wasting your money at a frivolous University, regardless of what medium they teach through.WGU is a joke, as is are the schools like it backed by corporations and give people academic credit for "life experience" with no minimum academic standards - and given your superficial understanding of the topic at hand, perhaps its not such a bad school for you after all. Again, enjoy your time at the school of your choice.


Hey totj, since you are in the IT world, how about you jump over to the Federal Employees You Be the Judge Section, under the FCIP thread, and try to talk some sense into some of them. I'm in the HR world, but we have a few on there arguing that a degree in Computer Science from 1980 is more valuable than an IT degree from MIT in 2011.

One actually is arguing that the MIT graduate is less qualified because the 1980 degree in Computer Science did a better job of teaching how things in the IT world really work.

It's really incredible that these same people work in IT for the federal government.
15 years of federal HR experience.
truotsuko  
#58 Posted : Tuesday, July 19, 2011 5:35:13 AM(UTC)

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Listen to anyone who cares, never once have tried to pass WGU as anything other than a fully credentialed University I have not and will not try to compare the school to any other. All I have ever tried to make folks understand in this thread is that the school has all the accreditations required by law to be called a university in the USA so you may not like their approach to teaching that is fine, but to deride something definitively all I ask is for evidence other than a speech, because every credible agency in the US can’t be wrong and a few citizens see the light based on what? If they are so smart share the source of their knowledge for all to learn from, that is after all what blogs like this are about; it is about sharing knowledge not erroneous personal feelings backed with no facts at all.

truotsuko2011-07-19 13:41:43
cheesefan  
#59 Posted : Tuesday, July 19, 2011 5:56:21 AM(UTC)

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If you are a GS 12, you should consider this:

http://cio-nii.defense.gov/sites/iasp2/prospective.html

It's a IA Scholarship for current GS employees. The scholarship hasn't opened up yet. Its to cover costs for your degree.

truotsuko  
#60 Posted : Tuesday, July 19, 2011 6:03:56 AM(UTC)

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Thanks cheesefan, I am actually also looking into that we shall see where the chips fall...

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