Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Military


Post your thoughts and opinions here about current military-related news topics.

2 Pages12>
Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
McGooHMM764  
#1 Posted : Sunday, August 15, 2010 10:25:40 PM(UTC)

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/15/2010(UTC)
Posts: 15

As a reservist I understand that I have up to 15 days per year which can be used for the two week annual training period but what about additional reserve drills?

If I want to take time off to perform additional drills, additional training periods (ATP’s) can I take unpaid leave or paid leave? What is the limit to the amount of additional days I can take to perform reserve duty?
martyb  
#2 Posted : Monday, August 16, 2010 12:34:05 AM(UTC)

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 11/3/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,527

Thanks: 6 times
Was thanked: 16 time(s) in 14 post(s)
It's between you & your supervisor as to how much annual leave you want to burn.  You only get the 15 days, and that's got to be accompanied by military orders, which you'll have to turn in to your payroll office.  Any other extra days you want to pull comes out of your annual leave balance.  However, if you happen to be activated, then there are some provisions for some additional Military Leave days, up to a specified limit.  I don't know for sure, but I'm thinking either an additional 30 or 45 days.  That's not for you to just volunteer to pull additional drills though.  I think it has to be related to a deployment or similar situation.  I never used the additional time, so I'm not 100% sure about the details.
 
As for unpaid leave, I doubt your supervisor is going to want to grant you LWOP to pull a couple of days here & there for additional drills or individual duty days.  It would be more for an extended period of time.  Besides that, why would you want to have unpaid time from your fed civilian job to pull man-days?  Just doesn't seem cost-effective to me.
martyb2010-08-16 08:41:18
Forum trolls to 0%
thanks 1 user thanked for this useful post.
Airborne_Joe on 1/15/2019(UTC)
Texas Austin  
#3 Posted : Monday, August 16, 2010 6:24:51 AM(UTC)
overpaid

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 5/19/2009(UTC)
Posts: 778

McGooHMM764 wrote:
As a reservist I understand that I have up to 15 days per year which can be used for the two week annual training period but what about additional reserve drills?

If I want to take time off to perform additional drills, additional training periods (ATP�s) can I take unpaid leave or paid leave? What is the limit to the amount of additional days I can take to perform reserve duty?
 
Up to including all of your vacation
Admin2010-08-20 10:12:03
BRAC2005  
#4 Posted : Monday, August 16, 2010 1:05:51 PM(UTC)

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 4/26/2007(UTC)
Posts: 25

Hi

The following comments should apply to most FERS employees/active-status reservists.

15 days of Military Leave should get you through 12 days of Annual Tour (Mon - Fri of the following week) and 5 of your 12 days of Inactive Duty Training days -- assuming you don't split your AT.  If you are in the Unit Program (aka Cat A or Traditional Reservist), you will pull IDTs on drill weekends and there will be no need to take any AL -- assuming you work a M-F schedule.

If you are in the IMA Program (aka Cat B), the remaining 7 days needed to satisfy the IDT portion of your annual participation requirement would typically be  performed while in AL or LWOP status. IDTs can sometimes be performed in a telecommute status depending on the work you do and at such times as doesn't require you to use AL or ML.  Your service will have specific telecommuting rules if they allow this.

If you are involuntarily or voluntarily ordered to active duty, e.g., to support contingency operations or steady-state operations, you will typically be placed in a LWOP-US status, which should not diminish your AL.  There are limited duration  save-pay rules  depending, in part, on whether you were voluntarily or involuntarily ordered to AD and several participation incentives become relevant.  For example, assuming you have not already earned a full Post 9/11 GI Bill benefit, the days you perform duty in a status other than AT or IDT will count towards earning that benefit.  While on active duty you can transfer some or all of this benefit to your children and spouse.  In addition, you may earn credit towards earlier receipt of retired pay --  3 months earlier for every 90 days of qualifying AD in a FY after 28 Jan 08.  (There is legislation in progress that will eliminate the FY requirement.)  The duty performed in this status and while not using AL or ML, can be credited towards your FERS service for retirement purposes  if you make the military deposit.  And, of course, you earn points that increase the amount of the reserve pension you may ultimately receive.  In short, there are significant  incentives intended to encourage greater participation by reservists.  

But, as Martyb says, the extent to which you can respond to a call to service as a reservist is, practically, dependent on how supportive your civil service employer and reserve supervisor/program manager are.  This is sometimes a tough sell when these individual do not see the sacrifices or value added in performing reserve duty.   

I don't have access to my source documents right now.  I will try to post them later.  In the meantime, a full description of reserve participation requirements should be available through your reserve program manager.  The Resource Management Group at HQ AFRC has an excellent publication which I believe they call the "IR Guide."  It is as comprehensive and well-sourced description of the program as I have found.   Some of this is overly complicated, laden with jargon and easily misunderstood, so I highly recommend you spend some time in official guidance, like the IR Guide, fact sheets developed for your service's reserves and your own service's regulations on reserve participation.  This will be time well spent.

Hope this helps.


McGooHMM764  
#5 Posted : Monday, August 16, 2010 11:14:34 PM(UTC)

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/15/2010(UTC)
Posts: 15

Thanks for the info. I am a reserve pilot. In addition to the weekend drills, I must fly at least an additional two to three days per month. I would have to take off from work to do this. Is there unpaid leave? Or must I take a vacation day? Is there an issue with being paid by the military and the taking a federal service vacation day? Could my reserve participation impact my potential to be promoted?

Pick  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, August 17, 2010 3:18:33 AM(UTC)

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 2/6/2010(UTC)
Posts: 2,204

McGooHMM764 wrote:
Thanks for the info. I am a reserve pilot. In addition to the weekend drills, I must fly at least an additional two to three days per month. I would have to take off from work to do this. Is there unpaid leave? Or must I take a vacation day? Is there an issue with being paid by the military and the taking a federal service vacation day? Could my reserve participation impact my potential to be promoted?
 
Leave without pay (LWOP) is an option, provided your supervisor allows it.  However, he/she can make you take regular leave for your ATAs once you've exhausted your military leave.  There's no issue taking a vacation day and getting paid by the military - people do it all the time in the Reserve and Guard. 
 
Regarding promotion potential, they are not allowed to discriminate based on your reserve status.  That being said, the Federal Government is one of the worst offenders when it comes to dealing with reservists.  Also, being a reservist precludes you from working in Emergency Essential civilian positions.  So, if your career field has a lot of those (like mine), it can affect it.  I know many that have faced that decision in the last few years and chose their civil service career over their reserve careers.
BRAC2005  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, August 17, 2010 4:05:21 AM(UTC)

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 4/26/2007(UTC)
Posts: 25

This should help:

 

From OPM on the types of ML:  http://www.opm.gov/flsa/oca/leave/HTML/military.asp  

 

Also from OPM on duty status while performing reserve duty:  http://www.opm.gov/FAQS/QA.aspx?fid=e64d74ab-20a3-484c-8682-d2a2b46c22da&pid=74e869e0-f8fd-417c-89d9-64c566d4ff76  

 

The regulations at 5 CFR 353.208:  http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2007/janqtr/pdf/5cfr353.208.pdf    

 

The law at  5 USC 6323:  http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/5/usc_sec_05_00006323----000-.html 

 

There is unpaid leave – referred to as leave without pay (LWOP)

 

You are not required to take annual leave.  See the OPM materials.

 

It is possible to be  paid for both your reserve duty and civil service if you are in a pay status for both.  (It is possible to perform reserve duty for points only.)  

 

Any activity that interferes with the performance of your duties as a civil servant could impact your competitiveness for promotion.  The trick is to ensure it doesn’t interfere.  You accomplish this by demonstrating that these "extracurricular" activities, which may include leading, planning, organizing, etc.,  make you a better employee and allow you to outperforming your competition.

 

See the following on "santuary" and waivers:  http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0PAK/is_6_60/ai_n31181086/   And,  para 4.10 of the IR Guide re how you can continue to participate while with the amount of AD time you have:


"4.10. Active Duty Sanctuary Waivers Associated with RPA Tours and MPA Tours.

Active Duty Sanctuary is a window between 18 and 20 years TAFMS in which a member must be given the opportunity to stay in the Air Force to receive an active duty 20-year retirement. Claiming sanctuary means the reservist will be placed in active duty status for the amount of time adding up to 20 years TAFMS and then the IR must retire at the 20 year TAFMS date. A member in an active duty status is eligible for an assignment and a permanent change of station. If member chooses to decline the assignment offered, their right to sanctuary protection is foregone. IRs with between 16 and 20 years of Total Active Federal Military Service (TAFMS) who request RPA-ADS (IMA only) or MPA tours must sign a sanctuary waiver prior to the tour start date that precludes them from claiming sanctuary during the tour. Failure to sign the requested waiver will prevent orders publication.

4.10.1. Statement of Understanding

The waiver is accomplished via a Statement of Understanding (SOU), signed by the member, and processed through the assigned Program Manager to HQ RMG. Each blanket waiver package must be accomplished for 179 days. Two or more waivers may need to be accomplished to cover the entire tour. The assigned BIMAA or Program Manager is the point of contact for initiating active duty sanctuary waiver requests and preparation of the SOU.

4.10.2. Point Credit

When a member waives their right to claim sanctuary, they will still earn the points to qualify for an active duty retirement upon reaching 20 years TAFMS. A reservist, not claiming sanctuary, may be allowed to continue participating for points and/or pay past 20 years of TAFMS."


Better late than never.



 

tromba  
#8 Posted : Wednesday, September 29, 2010 8:55:11 AM(UTC)

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/16/2008(UTC)
Posts: 20

When using Leave without Pay for active military orders, why does your annual/sick leave not continue to accrue?  What if you split up your away time with military and LWOP?

Leave Accrual:  An
employee continues to accrue leave until the employee accumulates 80
hours of LWOP during a pay period.  At this point, the employee does not
earn annual or sick leave during that pay period. The employee earns
leave in the next succeeding pay periods until he or she again accumulates 80 hours of LWOP during a pay period (5 CFR 630.208).
also: Nonpay status for employees
who are performing military duty or being paid workers’ compensation counts as
a continuation of Federal employment for all purposes upon the employee’s return to duty.


mhc5096  
#9 Posted : Friday, October 01, 2010 9:49:32 AM(UTC)

Rank: Advisor

Groups: Registered
Joined: 6/1/2008(UTC)
Posts: 175

When using Leave without Pay for active military orders, why does your annual/sick leave not continue to accrue?  What if you split up your away time with military and LWOP?
If you have to use LWOP to perform military duty, that would be the best way to plan it. As long as you keep the total hours below 80 in a given pay period, you will continue to accrue both annual and sick leave.
CIS 2008-Present<br />ICE 2007-2008<br />CBP 2003-2007<br />INS 2001-2003<br /><br />USAFR 2009-2011<br />VTANG 1995-2009<br />USNR 1989-1995
tromba  
#10 Posted : Saturday, October 02, 2010 6:50:04 AM(UTC)

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/16/2008(UTC)
Posts: 20


MHC, do you have a reference for that?  I can't seem to find anything on military related LWOP and ann/sick leave accrual.  Thanks.
tromba2010-10-02 15:55:59
6bsfc  
#11 Posted : Saturday, October 02, 2010 7:14:39 AM(UTC)
crespobf

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 10/2/2010(UTC)
Posts: 2

USERRA establishes the cumulative length of time that an individual may be absent from work for military duty and retain reemployment rights to five years (the previous law provided four years of active duty, plus an additional year if it was for the convenience of the Government). There are important exceptions to the five-year limit, including initial enlistments lasting more than five years, periodic National Guard and Reserve training duty, and involuntary active duty extensions and recalls, especially during a time of national emergency. USERRA clearly establishes that reemployment protection does not depend on the timing, frequency, duration, or nature of an individual's service as long as the basic eligibility criteria are met.

The Uniformed Services Employment and Reemployment Rights Act of 1994 (USERRA 38 U.S.C. 4301-4335)
6bsfc  
#12 Posted : Saturday, October 02, 2010 7:17:11 AM(UTC)
crespobf

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 10/2/2010(UTC)
Posts: 2

USERRA establishes the cumulative length of time that an individual may be absent from work for military duty and retain reemployment rights to five years (the previous law provided four years of active duty, plus an additional year if it was for the convenience of the Government). There are important exceptions to the five-year limit, including initial enlistments lasting more than five years, periodic National Guard and Reserve training duty, and involuntary active duty extensions and recalls, especially during a time of national emergency. USERRA clearly establishes that reemployment protection does not depend on the timing, frequency, duration, or nature of an individual's service as long as the basic eligibility criteria are met
 
The Uniformed Services Employment and Reemployment Rights Act of 1994 (USERRA 38 U.S.C. 4301-4335)
mhc5096  
#13 Posted : Saturday, October 02, 2010 7:58:36 AM(UTC)

Rank: Advisor

Groups: Registered
Joined: 6/1/2008(UTC)
Posts: 175

tromba wrote:
MHC, to have a reference for that?  I can't seem to find anything on military related LWOP and ann/sick leave accrual.  Thanks.
 
You had the reference in your previous post. There is no specific "military related LWOP" regulation. Leave accrual rules related to LWOP are the same regardless of the reason the leave is taken. As long as you do not use 80 hours of LWOP in a pay period, you will accrue annual/sick leave at your normal rate.
 
If you are required to attend military training for an extended period of time, schedule at least one 8 hour day of regular annual or military leave with 72 hours of LWOP each pay period and you will be fine. I've done this numerous times over the past 10 years in 4 different agencies.
CIS 2008-Present<br />ICE 2007-2008<br />CBP 2003-2007<br />INS 2001-2003<br /><br />USAFR 2009-2011<br />VTANG 1995-2009<br />USNR 1989-1995
tromba  
#14 Posted : Monday, October 18, 2010 8:44:24 AM(UTC)

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/16/2008(UTC)
Posts: 20


HR is telling me for
every multiple of 80 hours of non pay I will not accrue any leave. 
This means that when LWOP hits, 80, 160, 240, 320 etc, I will not accrue any leave
for that pay period, despite if I used LWOP and leave intermittently. 
OPM's website:  Leave Accrual
Full-time employees do not earn leave during any pay period that they accumulate 80 hours of nonpay time
during a leave year.  Employees earn leave in the next succeeding pay
periods until they again accumulate 80 hours of nonpay time during a pay
period.  Any nonpay time that does not require a reduction in leave is dropped at the end of the leave year.


MHC, perhaps your 4 agencies choose to let you accrue leave.  Or my HR doesn't know anything?  I guess you could read the above to mean 2 different things...
  My folks won't budge.


mhc5096 wrote:
tromba wrote:
MHC, to have a reference for that?  I can't seem to find anything on military related LWOP and ann/sick leave accrual.  Thanks.
 
You had the reference in your previous post. There is no specific "military related LWOP" regulation. Leave accrual rules related to LWOP are the same regardless of the reason the leave is taken. As long as you do not use 80 hours of LWOP in a pay period, you will accrue annual/sick leave at your normal rate.
 
If you are required to attend military training for an extended period of time, schedule at least one 8 hour day of regular annual or military leave with 72 hours of LWOP each pay period and you will be fine. I've done this numerous times over the past 10 years in 4 different agencies.
tromba2010-10-18 16:53:06
Tom  
#15 Posted : Sunday, December 05, 2010 10:22:02 PM(UTC)
pensapilot

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 12/5/2010(UTC)
Posts: 2

I am on LWOP -US and my orders state 'Contingency Operations".  I have chosen to take intermittent leave in the form of 2 days of Military and 1 day of Annual per pay period.  My Agency considers me to be in a "Pay Status" for the entire pay period even though the remaining days are LWOP.  I am trying to find out if they should cover my portion of FEHB payments during these pay periods.  As it stands now, I am paying my FEHB and netting very little benefit to splitting my leave like this.
Am I better off just taking all my Military Leave up front and then being placed in what they consider a "non-pay" staus to cover my FEHB?
Brian  
#16 Posted : Friday, January 14, 2011 4:39:05 AM(UTC)
intrepid

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 1/14/2011(UTC)
Posts: 9

Pensapilot,

Did you ever figure out an answer to this question?  Are you saying "non-pay" status they would pay for FEHB, but in a "pay status" you have to cover FEHB?

I have a similar situation.  I'm wondering if it's better to take a MIL-LV or a COMP or Annual-LV one day every pay period, or whether it's better to bunch MIL-LV and COMP and Annual-LV up front and then do LWOP for the rest of the military tour.

Advantage of spreading out the days seems to be that leave and sick day accrual would continue, but then I would have to maintain payments for FEHB ("pay status"), and I would probably come out behind since I'm getting paid for only 1 day every pay period.  Also, on 30-day+ orders, I'm thinking I don't need the FEHB benefits.  Is there any way to keep accruing leave/sick days without keeping the FEHB going?

Also, I think there is a slight benefit I didn't expect.  Is it possible to take an Annual-LV, or COMP, or MIL-LV day next to any federal holiday and then get both of them?  I think if the federal holiday is surrounded by LWOP, then I would not get paid for it.


Brian  
#17 Posted : Friday, January 14, 2011 4:41:51 AM(UTC)
intrepid

Rank: Newbie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 1/14/2011(UTC)
Posts: 9



mhc5096,

You previously wrote, "If you are required to attend military training for an extended period
of time, schedule at least one 8 hour day of regular annual or military
leave with 72 hours of LWOP each pay period and you will be fine. I've done this numerous times over the past 10 years in 4 different agencies."

I have a similar
situation.  I'm wondering if it's better to take a MIL-LV or a COMP or
Annual-LV one day every pay period, or whether it's better to bunch
MIL-LV and COMP and Annual-LV up front and then do LWOP for the rest of the military tour.

Advantage of spreading out the days seems to
be that leave and sick day accrual would continue, but then I would have
to maintain payments for FEHB ("pay status"), and I would probably come
out behind since I'm getting paid for only 1 day every pay period. 
Also, on 30-day+ orders, I'm thinking I don't need the FEHB benefits because I would have military benefits. 
Is there any way to keep accruing leave/sick days without keeping the FEHB going?

Also, I think there is a slight benefit I didn't
expect.  Is it possible to take an Annual-LV, or COMP, or MIL-LV day
next to any federal holiday and then get both of them?  I think if the federal holiday is surrounded by LWOP, then I would not get paid for it.

Labelle  
#18 Posted : Monday, January 17, 2011 3:19:13 PM(UTC)

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 9/27/2010(UTC)
Posts: 584

I was just hired 3 weeks ago and start as a parttimer.  My work schedule includes night Saturdays and Sundays.  I'm a USMC reservist and this weekend is drill weekend.  I understand I have military leave entitlement.  Would I be entitled to a full pay using military leave?
Labelle2011-01-17 23:29:08
Labelle  
#19 Posted : Saturday, January 22, 2011 4:00:05 AM(UTC)

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 9/27/2010(UTC)
Posts: 584



Labelle wrote:
I was just hired 3 weeks ago and start as a parttimer.  My work schedule includes night Saturdays and Sundays.  I'm a USMC reservist and this weekend is drill weekend.  I understand I have military leave entitlement.  Would I be entitled to a full pay using military leave?

USERRA of 1994 ensures persons who serve in the military are not disadvantaged in their civilian careers because of their service.  Accordingly the federal government is a "model employer" under this Act.  Apparently TSA allows for 120 hours of military leave per budget year.  My drill this weekend is paid military leave. 
Labelle2011-01-22 12:05:59
martyb  
#20 Posted : Saturday, January 22, 2011 8:50:18 AM(UTC)

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 11/3/2006(UTC)
Posts: 3,527

Thanks: 6 times
Was thanked: 16 time(s) in 14 post(s)
The typical situation is that drill is performed on Saturday & Sunday, when most people are off from their regular jobs, and then they use the military leave for their annual tour/summer camp etc.  You're in a different situation though, and are going to have to come to some kind of understanding or arrangement with your supervision about working things out on your regular drill weekends.  That might include using some annual leave, re-scheduling your work schedule that particular weekend each month, or working out some way to perform your drills on your off days.  Some, all, or none of that may work in your specific case.  I don't know about the USMC, but the 2 DOD agencies I've worked for (Air Force & DCMA) require military orders for use of military leave from my civilian job.  In the Air Force Reserve, no military orders are generated for regular weekend drills.  They are considered Inactive Duty training periods and no orders are cut for them, so no military leave.  I expect you'll have to come up with something a little more creative in this case.  Good luck. martyb2011-01-22 16:56:04
Forum trolls to 0%
Rss Feed  Atom Feed
Users browsing this topic
Guest
2 Pages12>
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.


This page was generated in 1.648 seconds.