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Beagle  
#1 Posted : Saturday, October 16, 2010 10:08:45 AM(UTC)
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scissors wrote:
Has anyone ever been duped out of a job or clearance based on the stupid polygraph device? Here is an old episode of Penn & Teller that shows just how much of a trap the polygraph is, in a humorous and entertaining sort of way. Frankly, I say it's all true.

http://video.yahoo.com/watch/5618156/14742989


LOL that blond is a trip.  Mike can do better.  BTW that blond should have gotten a polygraph she's not perfect, I wonder what she's hiding.

All you need is a tight A$$.
Beagle2010-10-16 18:41:30
cyberdefender  
#2 Posted : Saturday, October 16, 2010 10:45:57 AM(UTC)
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NSFW! (at the end)
 
thanks
Brian99  
#3 Posted : Saturday, October 16, 2010 12:23:47 PM(UTC)
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I love Penn & Teller.

I have a question for everyone here... Has anyone ever received a denial letter stating only and simply "You lied on your polygraph." or "You said on your form, and you said the same thing again in polygraph, but we detected you were lying."???

Brian992010-10-16 20:29:02
lazyfed  
#4 Posted : Saturday, October 16, 2010 12:27:39 PM(UTC)
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it happens a lot usually that your polygrapg detected some mistruths that we were able to verify
Witchfinder  
#5 Posted : Monday, October 18, 2010 1:28:06 AM(UTC)
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There's alot of people on here whom that has happened to.  Just do a search. I was set to go back for a re-test.  I opted out of the process as I had already done some research by that time.  I would be lying if I went back and said "No" if asked a question about researching the topic.  What's that old axiom from the G.I. Joe cartoon, "Knowing is half the battle".
Brian99  
#6 Posted : Monday, October 18, 2010 2:37:37 AM(UTC)
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Every single person that goes for a poly has researched the topic, so if the guy asks 'did you research the topic?' That is 99% of the time, YES answer, even if they say NO. Which makes a conflict because then they might treat you as someone 'well-researched' and be more sensitive and suspicious.

Which is silly, because there's no such thing as a lie detector.

anti_vet_4_life  
#7 Posted : Monday, October 18, 2010 2:59:29 AM(UTC)
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lazyfed wrote:
it happens a lot usually that your polygrapg detected some mistruths that we were able to verify
 
Lol  I love the way you are just sponging off welfare and then pretend you are working for some agency.
Witchfinder  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, October 19, 2010 1:59:33 AM(UTC)
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At the time,  I hadn't. Whatever I had seen on Maury and Dr.  Phil was all I knew.  The fact that that is the mosit visible place for them in the media should've tipped me off.
Lyly L  
#9 Posted : Wednesday, October 20, 2010 3:26:25 PM(UTC)
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Beagle wrote:




scissors wrote:
Has anyone ever been duped out of a job or clearance based on the stupid polygraph device? Here is an old episode of Penn & Teller that shows just how much of a trap the polygraph is, in a humorous and entertaining sort of way. Frankly, I say it's all true.

http://video.yahoo.com/watch/5618156/14742989


LOL that blond is a trip.  Mike can do better.  BTW that blond should have gotten a polygraph she's not perfect, I wonder what she's hiding.

All you need is a tight A$$.

Such a very amazing link!
<br /><a href="http://movies&#111;nlinefree.biz" target="_blank">Watch Paranormal Activity 2 Online Free</a>
Brian99  
#10 Posted : Wednesday, October 20, 2010 11:20:39 PM(UTC)
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Witchfinder wrote:
At the time,  I hadn't. Whatever I had seen on Maury and Dr.  Phil was all I knew.  The fact that that is the mosit visible place for them in the media should've tipped me off.


huh? Can you please rephrase, I didn't understand what you just said.
Witchfinder  
#11 Posted : Sunday, October 24, 2010 9:55:42 AM(UTC)
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Where else does one see the polygraph on tv most of the time? Talk shows. There they are referred to in layman's terms as "Lie Detectors". The general public hears lie detector and thinks, "yes, this machine can really detect lies, it works, without a doubt." With such topics as "Who is My Baby's Dady?" and "Did You Molest My Child?" Now what are these talk shows? They are Maury, Steve Wilkos and Dr. Phil. Not the most classy of tv talk shows. Now what drives talk shows? Money just like every other program out there.  But them being in the daytime, they have to contend with game shows, soaps, and other talk shows/variety shows devoted to celebrity and gossip. All of them are out for a piece of the coveted 18-49 pie. What brings in the most eyes? Scandals and outrageous actions bring in a sizable peice of the ratings.  

 

Now somebody going up to take a test will be on the tube in front of a couple of hundred thousand to a million people watching the show, not to mention, a live, often rowdy audience in the studio. It's no surprise that the producer's of the talk shows often ambush their guests with either people they will meet or procedures they will have to go through. A clear example of that can be seen in the Jenny Jones disaster of the 1990s.
 
I remember watching an episode one time of Steve Wilkos.  A woman's family accused their mother of being physically and emotionally abusive with them when they were younger. The mother took a polygraph about her being abusive to her children. She denied all accusations and she was found to be truthful on the polygraph. Steve started getting mad with the children about blaming their mother and making her look bad, but then the mother slipped and said that she had stuck one of the children's hands in scalding hot water to teach them a lesson. Steve then started to get mad at her, but never brought up "truthful" results of the poly.
 
Now, in the past, there have been two shows devoted to polygraphy.  One, a Court TV show, with former FBI polygrapher Jack Trimarco entitled Fake Out, which did not last long. Another one, Moment of Truth with Mark L. Wahlberg on FOX, which also did not last long. I read some scathing reviews about it at the time and I remember watching about an episode and a half of it. I felt like talking a shower after watching the show as it seemed, seedy. But, it brough in money for a short period of time. I can even go to a Wal Mart and go into the clearance section and buy the board game of it with a little hand held lie detector and at a gut bucket clearance rate.
 
Now, there are shows that have highlighted the polygraph in the past, but those are more critical of it. One episode of BattleStar Galactica had a polygraph procedure that was stopped by the character of Adama. One recent episode of NCIS had Mark Harmon stop a polygraph after being strapped in for a number of questions. Also, a pretty recent episode of the Mentalist had the character played by Robin Tunney fail a polygraph and it was only with the help of the Mentalist played by Simon Baker that she avoided being fired arrested for her "crimes". Now these are niche shows for the 18-49 ranges group, they skew higher, so it wouldn't really make an impression.
 
Then there are the news programs which are always critical of polygraph's. I know of two past episodes of 60 Minutes that have shown the folly of polygraphy. I know of one episode of Dateline and 20/20 dealing with the errors of believing in polygraphy. One episode of 20/20 back in June of this year, dealt with a very grisly rape and murder of a little girl.
 
The mother had left town to visit friends or something and the father stayed home with his son and daughter. The daughter was kidnapped and taken to a shed away from the home where she was raped and then murdered.  The father woke up in the morning and reported his daughter missing. The cops searched everywhere and the surrounding property. Across town, police responded to a disturbance and they arrested this one guy.  He asked the police if they had already found the little girl yet. Police thought it was weird because the news still really hadn't spread out on an amber alert, but thought nothing else of it.  A day or so later they found a bloody panty and her remains in the shed. They brought in the family and interrogated the 6 year old brother. Then brought in the father and made him take a poly, which he failed.  After a couple of hours of interrogation he confessed to the rape and murder of his daughter.
 
 
He was sentenced to life and was put away for a couple of years. His family, including his brother didn't believe it and hired an attorney to get him free. Soon this other woman came forward about her ex boyfriend who strangely talked one time about the little girl. Her ex boyfriend was the man that had been arrested by the police the day after the abduction and asked if the little girl had been found yet. He had kidnapped her, raped her, and killed her. The father was set free, even though the poly deemed him a murderer, kidnapper, and a rapist of his little angel. 
ineedajob  
#12 Posted : Tuesday, October 26, 2010 2:45:14 PM(UTC)
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The poly seems to serve as a CYA measure, so that if there was ever a
leak or misconduct among the folks, an agency can turn around and say,
"we could have had no idea!  In good faith, we polygraphed them for
peat!"  The problem with that is laxness in background as other warning signs that will be ignored b/c someone is polygraphed.


I don't see the purpose of it.  Some places will hang their hat on that
they get a lot of confessions coaxed with the aide of a polygraph. 
Hence, why the previous poster says "they verify their findings".  I
wouldn't take an issue if the polygraph was used as an aide for extra
digging in areas of interest during a BI, but the poster simply means
that confessions are garnered from it.  But these are confessions under a
form of duress.  In essence, the polygraph is being used as witness
against the testee.  So when a polygraph test becomes an interrogation,
the testee is stressed and just wants to justify/explain why the results
could show a reaction, to the point of actually lying!  As a
prosecutor, I would be suspect of any confessions garnered under that
context.....or any solicited confessions for that matter, unless details only a guilty party would know come to light.  People say stupid things, happens all the time.


So what's the result here:  a person can lie and the polygraph gives
evidence but more investigation is necessary to confirm a person doesn't
lie the polygraph shows no indication, and more investigation is
necessary, a person doesn't lie but the polygraph says he is and more
investigation exonerates him but never removes suspicion, or a person
lies the polygraph doesn't show it and more investigation shows the person is a liar.


The risk of the polygraph is that it is used IN PLACE of proper
investigations, which happens most commonly in applicant screening. 
It's sad if an applicant for a job gets thrown out underservingly, it's a
tragedy if a case is wrongly pursued or dropped in place of
investigation b/c the results of a poly.
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