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Should I sell back my Military service? - Should I sell back my Military service?
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springwater  
#21 Posted : Wednesday, December 21, 2011 7:27:49 AM(UTC)

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sort of related but after talking to my HR and doing some research I'm still confused. What course of action would you recommend for someone who's done their initial service obligation (more than 4, less than 8 TIS) but is on the fence about going back into the reserves/guard for the long haul (20+). I have less than 3 years federal TIS. Should I even bother with the dual commitment or just buy back my time and focus on my civil service job?
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Glenn  
#22 Posted : Wednesday, December 21, 2011 9:32:39 PM(UTC)
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springwater wrote:
sort of related but after talking to my HR and doing some research I'm still confused. What course of action would you recommend for someone who's done their initial service obligation (more than 4, less than 8 TIS) but is on the fence about going back into the reserves/guard for the long haul (20+). I have less than 3 years federal TIS. Should I even bother with the dual commitment or just buy back my time and focus on my civil service job?
 
Although not specifically stated, I presume you are referring to active duty service.
 
To me this situation leaves little question. 

If a civil servant retired from military service, he/she should consider the benefits (mainly financial) for making a deposit to apply the military time to their federal civilian career.

If a civil servant did not retire from active duty (the example you provide), he/she should make a deposit to apply the military time to their federal civilian career.  Depending on the military branch in which one served this could be 3 or 4 years.  The net effect of applying this time is to add 3 or 4 years (already served) to your federal (civilian) time that otherwise will not be used toward service computation for retirement. 

  • The key will be to complete your post-56 military deposit within the first two years of your civilian federal service so you aren't subject to the interest on the amount you will need to pay. 
  • Even if one waited to pay the amount after the initial two year period, the amount would likely not be significant.
With respect to future Reserve/National Guard service, most circumstances permit Reserve or National Guard members under Title 32 to collect both a federal civil service retirement and a reserve or national guard retirement.    See these references: 
IT-Fed2011-12-22 05:49:05
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USAF  
#23 Posted : Thursday, December 22, 2011 1:28:25 AM(UTC)

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Thanks for retiring and taking a government job from us Veterans who did not retire.Angry
Congress is looking at making "double-dipping" a disqualifier. I can't believe you are actually wasting space on here talking about getting more of what you already got.
Be proud of yourself for retiring and keeping Veterans jobless. Buy this backCensored!!!
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mudpie  
#24 Posted : Thursday, December 22, 2011 1:54:32 AM(UTC)

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You can still do both. Buy back your active duty time. That will back date your civil service date and move you up the RIF ladder and closer to retirement. You can join the Guard and earn time towards a state retirement check as well, but you can't collect until your in your 60's even if you complete 20 years in your 40's. Same for Reserve except the Reserve retirement is a federal check.
 
BTW. If you retire from the military and civil service, you can't collect both check at once (except a Guard retirement), but you can collect a military retirement check while still working as a civil servant.
mudpie2011-12-22 10:03:39
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Glenn  
#25 Posted : Thursday, December 22, 2011 2:01:26 AM(UTC)
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mudpie wrote:
You can still do both. Buy back your active duty time. That will back date your civil service date and move you up the RIF ladder and closer to retirement. You can join the Guard and earn time towards a state retirement check as well, but you can't collect until your in your 60's even if you complete 20 years in your 40's. Same for Reserve except the Reserve retirement is a federal check.
 
BTW. If you retire from the military and civil service, you can't collect both check at once, but you can collect a military retirement check while still working as a civil servant.
With respect to the post-56 military deposit, I am hoping you left out a word in your comment about collecting a military retirement check. 
 
With few exceptions, you can not collect a military retirement check (and a civil service retirement check) if you retired from active duty military service and applied that time to your civil service retirement computation (SCD-Ret).  If one retires from the reserves or national guard, one can collect both retirement checks.
IT-Fed2011-12-22 10:50:26
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Glenn  
#26 Posted : Thursday, December 22, 2011 2:07:19 AM(UTC)
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USAF wrote:
Thanks for retiring and taking a government job from us Veterans who did not retire.Angry
Congress is looking at making "double-dipping" a disqualifier. I can't believe you are actually wasting space on here talking about getting more of what you already got.
Be proud of yourself for retiring and keeping Veterans jobless. Buy this backCensored!!!
 
Wow - you spread such unsolicited venom in a few words.
 
First, I did not "take" a job from anyone; I earned it.  With respect to wasting space, I believe many will disagree with you.
 
Indeed, I'm very proud of my service to this country in uniform and as a civilian federal employee, and the knowledge gained that I can share with others who have questions.  My current position and knowledge permits me to hire qualified applicants, including veterans.
 
Good day, and I hope your outlook improves!
IT-Fed2011-12-22 10:13:10
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hustonj  
#27 Posted : Thursday, December 22, 2011 2:40:52 AM(UTC)
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Federal military retirees who do NOT "but back" their military time can, indeed, receive both a Federal Civil Service retirement check and a Federal military retirement check.  Those who do "buy back" that time are specifically telling the Federal government that they WANT their military retirement payments to cease when they retire from the civil service.
 
There are very, very few military retirees for whom "buying back" their military service time for credit with the civil service makes any sense, mathematically.
 
Military veterans who are not entitled to a Federal military retirement check really should purchase credit with the civil service for their active duty time.
hustonj2011-12-22 10:46:53
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JAMES  
#28 Posted : Thursday, December 22, 2011 3:36:29 AM(UTC)
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I'm trying to figure out how you became and advisor with advice like this.  The amount of retired veterans in America is relatively small compared to the civilian world.  As for Congress, I haven't trusted their judgment for years, so that's why I get my information from vets who have gone or are going through the same thing as countless others; retired or other wise.  And to amplify IT-Fed's statement, I have earned my Government job.  As a matter of fact, this country owes every vet employment no matter what.  You should research your information concerning how many vets (retired or not) are actually employed by Federal agencies.  You might be surprised.
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Scott  
#29 Posted : Thursday, December 22, 2011 3:48:15 AM(UTC)
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Just for the record:
 
USAF = Newgrad.
 
She just hasn't used that log in for a while.
 
Scotter
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JAMES  
#30 Posted : Thursday, December 22, 2011 4:00:15 AM(UTC)
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Thanks for the clarification.
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Forrest Carver  
#31 Posted : Monday, December 26, 2011 12:31:26 AM(UTC)
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I know this has pretty much been answered, but I work with several retired vets who have all bought their time back. Like everyone else here said though, you have to do the math.

All of the guys I work with retired at E-7 (except for 1, who retired at E-6). However, they are all now GS-15 level guys (I say GS-15 level, they were NSPS YA-3's and now AQDEMO NH-4's). When they did the math, the extra 20-25 years (20-25%) added to their GS-15 retirement ended up being way more a month than, so they went with it.

As others have said, you keep getting your military retirement until you "re-retire" from civil service. Also, as others have said, you keep getting your disability check from the VA forever, whether you buy back your time or not. 

Last, the point that it moves you up the RIF ladder is absolutely true, and is worth considering in the current hiring freeze, RIF, buyout, etc environment.

In general, if you didn't retire from the military, buying your time back is a no-brainer. But, if you did, you pretty much have to be a GS-15 for it to be worth it, and even then only if you retired at the E-7 level. I've heard E-8 is the break-even point, so if you were E-8 or E-9, or pretty much any officer rank, it's is not going to make you any more money.
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Rich Nocis  
#32 Posted : Monday, December 26, 2011 8:02:11 AM(UTC)
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Gunny I did it I have 4 days until I'm done..Do the math for yourself.
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Out of the Hole  
#33 Posted : Monday, December 26, 2011 2:15:02 PM(UTC)

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mudpie wrote:
You can join the Guard and earn time towards a state retirement check as well, but you can't collect until your in your 60's even if you complete 20 years in your 40's. Same for Reserve except the Reserve retirement is a federal check.


I'm not sure that it matters in the context of this thread, but Air Guard retirements are administered by the same office (AFRPC) as the Air Force Reserves, and are both paid by DFAS.  It takes an act of the US Congress to change anything regarding Guard retirement so that's an indication that the state has no obligation in the matter.
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Fed1969  
#34 Posted : Monday, December 26, 2011 10:43:59 PM(UTC)

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In most cases, CSRS employees, should sell back military time.  The exception could be retired high grade military.

Military that did not retire should sell back military time.

You really have to do the math for retired military and FERS.  Retired enlisted, with high grade GS or SES probably should buy back military time.
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Rglennt  
#35 Posted : Friday, January 6, 2012 7:55:07 AM(UTC)

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I have heard of selling back my service time. I do not work since I started Disability. I don't understand this selling back or buy back stuff. So I guess my question is can I do this and gain a lump sum of cash? I served 10 years now I am unable to work due to disability.

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Glenn  
#36 Posted : Friday, January 6, 2012 10:27:25 AM(UTC)
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Rglennt wrote:

I have heard of selling back my service time. I do not work since I started Disability. I don't understand this selling back or buy back stuff. So I guess my question is can I do this and gain a lump sum of cash? I served 10 years now I am unable to work due to disability.

 
First, you ask a great question.
 
Because you are not employed by the federal government as a civilian the option of buying back your military time will not apply in your case.  Although it may appear to be semantics, there is no "selling back your military time" for money or "lump sum of cash" option.
 
"Buying back your military time" (slang for the Post-56 (Post-1956) Military Deposit) only benefits veterans or military retirees who are employees of the federal government.  Basically, this process adds the military service time to the federal civilian service.  The military service is added to the federal civilian government service for retirement purposes. 
 
Edited to add clarification - The civilian federal employee deposits 3%** of their total military earnings plus accrued interest (if the deposit is not made within their first two years of civil service. 
  • ** - the actual percentage amount is determined by the specific retirement system you are under (CSRS or FERS)

Hope my response helps your understanding.

IT-Fed2012-01-09 11:27:41
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street walker  
#37 Posted : Tuesday, August 13, 2013 1:52:03 PM(UTC)

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Wow,I bought back my 4 year's of active duty and I am also a retired air force reservist and am 50 years old.when I turn 60 I expect to receive my retirement pay.I work at the USPS with 28 years of service,I will have 34 years at the age of 56 at which time I plan on retiring for good.I also receive va disability,do I get all three?
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buckeyeguy2010  
#38 Posted : Tuesday, August 13, 2013 8:19:25 PM(UTC)

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street walker: I believe there is no question that you will continue to receive your VA disability compensation check when you "fully retire" from the USPS. Based on what happened to a number of former colleagues, I believe you will be able to get both your military reserve and your civil service retirement checks. If you will be retiring under FERS, then you will also be entitled to Social Security (SS) benefits eventually. In that case, your SS benefits might or might not be reduced but you would have to provide additional information to tell. If you will be retiring under CSRS, then you will be entitled to reduced SS benefits eventually but maybe unreduced SS benefits, again depending on additional information regarding your history/circumstances. If you have built up a Thrift Saving Plan (TSP) balance, then you will also qualify for TSP benefits.buckeyeguy20102013-08-14 05:00:49
Retreaded DD/GS Careerist
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RE  
#39 Posted : Friday, September 6, 2013 4:15:00 AM(UTC)
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I thought that it was called buy back. You mean that you can get paid for your service?
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Glenn  
#40 Posted : Friday, September 6, 2013 6:02:57 AM(UTC)
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rese wrote:
I thought that it was called buy back. You mean that you can get paid for your service?


"Buy back" is slang for military deposit (full name "Post-56 Military Deposit.") The buy back term was likely applied due to the net effect of depositing funds toward your civilian retirement computation. There is no direct payment for prior military service, only the opportunity to have it applied to your federal civil service computation date for retirement.
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