Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Federal Career Planning and Development

Are you looking to get promoted?
Maybe a change in your federal career?
Need tips on resume writing to land a federal job?
Or how to increase your salary or get a pay raise?

Join this active discussion with others climbing the same challenging career ladder.

Consider ordering some helpful resources or read today's top news stories on federal employee pay, benefits, retirement, job rights and other workplace issues by visiting FederalDaily.com.

2 Pages12>
Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
raafi  
#1 Posted : Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:08:37 PM(UTC)
raafi

Rank: Groupie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 7/17/2015(UTC)
Posts: 122

Thanks: 10 times
Was thanked: 4 time(s) in 4 post(s)
A friend of mine works for one of the federal agencies. She is currently in her probationary period hired just before the freeze. She is having issues with her supervisor. As per her, her supervisor went from nice to nuts in no time. As per her, her supervisor who is also fairly recently hired by the agency assigns her work to later say that this is not what she wanted. and gets threaten to get written off.
She is pretty good in her profession with over a decade of experience under her belt. She has a long way before her probationary period ends. She is miserable but at the same time doesn't want to leave the job, which she worked really hard for. She suspects that she will get fired so she is not sure whether to resign of get fired.

How does resignation/firing looks on the resume if she decide to look for another federal job in future?
I think she may be able to collect unemployment but for future perspective it will hurt her in long run. Right?
I told her she would lose her time in service if she doesn't find another federal gig(Impossible, thanks to hiring freeze) in 30 days I think, am I correct?

Bright side, I told her take a month long vacation and start job hunting again.

What would you do if it was you?
SDAnalyst  
#2 Posted : Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:22:34 PM(UTC)
SD Analyst

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/8/2013(UTC)
Posts: 2,095

Thanks: 1850 times
Was thanked: 377 time(s) in 322 post(s)
There are new regulations that require your SF-50, Notification of Personnel Action, to record whether you are resigning in lieu of termination or disciplinary action. HR puts that information on there. But if she resigns, it's possible her Supervisor won't indicate that to HR. She could find another private industry job and then resign showing reason "taking job in private sector." If she gets Terminated during Probation, that is also shown on her final SF-50. The new regulations, which apply to all Feds, require HR to obtain the Official Personnel Folder of any former Federal employee and review it prior to hiring the person. She could also try to find another Federal job and get out of there before she gets terminated. I would definitely be looking for another job, private or Fed, and get out of there ASAP.

I do know people that were Terminated during Probation and later rehired as a Fed, as well as those who resigned. They both just said the job was not a good fit, and were able to be rehired.

Edited by user Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:25:05 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

thanks 1 user thanked SD Analyst for this useful post.
raafi on 3/30/2017(UTC)
raafi  
#3 Posted : Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:27:55 PM(UTC)
raafi

Rank: Groupie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 7/17/2015(UTC)
Posts: 122

Thanks: 10 times
Was thanked: 4 time(s) in 4 post(s)
Originally Posted by: SDAnalyst Go to Quoted Post
There are new regulations that require your SF-50, Notification of Personnel Action, to record whether you are resigning in lieu of termination or disciplinary action. HR puts that information on there. But if she resigns, it's possible her Supervisor won't indicate that to HR. She could find another private industry job and then resign showing reason "taking job in private sector." If she gets Terminated during Probation, that is also shown on her final SF-50. The new regulations, which apply to all Feds, require HR to obtain the Official Personnel Folder of any former Federal employee and review it prior to hiring the person. She could also try to find another Federal job and get out of there before she gets terminated. I would definitely be looking for another job, private or Fed, and get out of there ASAP.


Thanks SDAnalyst.
Can her supervisor write her off after she offers her resignation?
Or fire her with her 2 weeks notice?
or get something written on her SF-50 after her submission of resignation?
Does she need to complete her 3 months before she resigns?

Edited by user Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:29:16 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

SDAnalyst  
#4 Posted : Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:43:21 PM(UTC)
SD Analyst

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 8/8/2013(UTC)
Posts: 2,095

Thanks: 1850 times
Was thanked: 377 time(s) in 322 post(s)
Originally Posted by: raafi Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: SDAnalyst Go to Quoted Post
There are new regulations that require your SF-50, Notification of Personnel Action, to record whether you are resigning in lieu of termination or disciplinary action. HR puts that information on there. But if she resigns, it's possible her Supervisor won't indicate that to HR. She could find another private industry job and then resign showing reason "taking job in private sector." If she gets Terminated during Probation, that is also shown on her final SF-50. The new regulations, which apply to all Feds, require HR to obtain the Official Personnel Folder of any former Federal employee and review it prior to hiring the person. She could also try to find another Federal job and get out of there before she gets terminated. I would definitely be looking for another job, private or Fed, and get out of there ASAP.


Thanks SDAnalyst.
Can her supervisor write her off after she offers her resignation?
Or fire her with her 2 weeks notice?
or get something written on her SF-50 after her submission of resignation?
Does she need to complete her 3 months before she resigns?

Not sure what "write her off" means, unless you mean "write her up." All that is, is a written warning. The fact that he's threatening to write her up tells me he is not experienced in the ways of Federal disciplinary action.

She can be Terminated at any time, no 2-week notice is needed for employees on Probation, although they usually do it at the end of a Pay Period. However, this type of action has to go through HR. He can't just say "you're fired." She needs to resign in writing, dated, so she will have that as backup in case he does tell HR it's a Termination. But with the written Resignation, she would have proof she actually resigned. She could also submit it to the HR office rather than to him. If he's a real jerk, I might do that and the last day say, "oh, today's my last day. I submitted my Resignation to HR already."

Also, she never loses her time in service. It is always counted if she's re-hired.

Edited by user Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:46:36 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

thanks 1 user thanked SD Analyst for this useful post.
raafi on 3/30/2017(UTC)
FS0201  
#5 Posted : Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:50:45 PM(UTC)
FS0201

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 12/22/2011(UTC)
Posts: 1,061

Thanks: 89 times
Was thanked: 258 time(s) in 224 post(s)
Originally Posted by: SDAnalyst Go to Quoted Post
I do know people that were Terminated during Probation and later rehired as a Fed, as well as those who resigned. They both just said the job was not a good fit, and were able to be rehired.


This is important to remember. Being terminated during probation (or trial period) is not the same as being fired; it is just a determination that the candidate is not a good fit for that position. I have seen many individuals terminated from one position, end up in another role a year later and be successful.

The excuse of, "I read it on FederalSoup..." won't work. Please do your due diligence.
raafi  
#6 Posted : Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:56:38 PM(UTC)
raafi

Rank: Groupie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 7/17/2015(UTC)
Posts: 122

Thanks: 10 times
Was thanked: 4 time(s) in 4 post(s)
Originally Posted by: SDAnalyst Go to Quoted Post


Also, she never loses her time in service. It is always counted if she's re-hired.


Thanks for clarifying that.
raafi  
#7 Posted : Thursday, March 30, 2017 1:59:11 PM(UTC)
raafi

Rank: Groupie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 7/17/2015(UTC)
Posts: 122

Thanks: 10 times
Was thanked: 4 time(s) in 4 post(s)
Originally Posted by: FS0201 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: SDAnalyst Go to Quoted Post
I do know people that were Terminated during Probation and later rehired as a Fed, as well as those who resigned. They both just said the job was not a good fit, and were able to be rehired.


This is important to remember. Being terminated during probation (or trial period) is not the same as being fired; it is just a determination that the candidate is not a good fit for that position. I have seen many individuals terminated from one position, end up in another role a year later and be successful.



I see. Not that she has done it but so during probationary period, there is no mention of bad performance or insubordination?
USTrans  
#8 Posted : Thursday, March 30, 2017 6:59:48 PM(UTC)
USTrans

Rank: Groupie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 11/17/2015(UTC)
Posts: 58
Man
Germany
Location: Kaiserslautern Military Community

Thanks: 11 times
Was thanked: 16 time(s) in 14 post(s)
This is all conjecture...Your friend really needs to sit down with her supervisor and just have a conversation about their working relationship. Probationary periods are 2-years if you were hired after Nov 2015...which is a long time. If the supervisor is aware of how she feels and he/she (Supervisor) does not acknowledge, then she should make decisions that is best for her. On the other hand, the supervisor could appreciate that she sat down with them. I am assuming this conversation has not already happened.
thanks 2 users thanked USTrans for this useful post.
TheUnderverse15 on 3/30/2017(UTC), JDSIII on 3/30/2017(UTC)
Mike in VT  
#9 Posted : Friday, March 31, 2017 3:28:05 AM(UTC)

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/26/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,102

Thanks: 13 times
Was thanked: 56 time(s) in 53 post(s)
Originally Posted by: raafi Go to Quoted Post
A friend of mine works for one of the federal agencies. She is currently in her probationary period hired just before the freeze. She is having issues with her supervisor. As per her, her supervisor went from nice to nuts in no time. As per her, her supervisor who is also fairly recently hired by the agency assigns her work to later say that this is not what she wanted. and gets threaten to get written off.
She is pretty good in her profession with over a decade of experience under her belt. She has a long way before her probationary period ends. She is miserable but at the same time doesn't want to leave the job, which she worked really hard for. She suspects that she will get fired so she is not sure whether to resign of get fired.

How does resignation/firing looks on the resume if she decide to look for another federal job in future?
I think she may be able to collect unemployment but for future perspective it will hurt her in long run. Right?
I told her she would lose her time in service if she doesn't find another federal gig(Impossible, thanks to hiring freeze) in 30 days I think, am I correct?

Bright side, I told her take a month long vacation and start job hunting again.

What would you do if it was you?


Here is my immediate concern...

You don't know if anything your friend says is accurate. The decision to fire somebody is not like it is in the private sector. There has to be a paper trail of incidents and conversations before a termination can be considered. In other words, if she has a feeling she is going to get fired, it's because she has had conversation with leadership multiple times about her performance. Also, most agencies have a Retention Board that looks at the probationary employees to determine if they are keepers. So it wouldn't be just one person's opinion.

BrownsFan  
#10 Posted : Friday, March 31, 2017 8:40:12 AM(UTC)
BrownsFan

Rank: Rookie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 12/20/2016(UTC)
Posts: 47
United States
Location: Virginia

Thanks: 2 times
Was thanked: 5 time(s) in 4 post(s)

DING....DING...DING!!! We have a winner!

I thought the same thing when reading this thread. You are reliant on the side you are being told is even close to accurate. Within the government the move to fire someone is lengthy and requires a detailed written reporting.

Your friend needs to have a professional one on one discussion with her supervisor. End of story.

Originally Posted by: Mike in VT Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: raafi Go to Quoted Post
A friend of mine works for one of the federal agencies. She is currently in her probationary period hired just before the freeze. She is having issues with her supervisor. As per her, her supervisor went from nice to nuts in no time. As per her, her supervisor who is also fairly recently hired by the agency assigns her work to later say that this is not what she wanted. and gets threaten to get written off.
She is pretty good in her profession with over a decade of experience under her belt. She has a long way before her probationary period ends. She is miserable but at the same time doesn't want to leave the job, which she worked really hard for. She suspects that she will get fired so she is not sure whether to resign of get fired.

How does resignation/firing looks on the resume if she decide to look for another federal job in future?
I think she may be able to collect unemployment but for future perspective it will hurt her in long run. Right?
I told her she would lose her time in service if she doesn't find another federal gig(Impossible, thanks to hiring freeze) in 30 days I think, am I correct?

Bright side, I told her take a month long vacation and start job hunting again.

What would you do if it was you?


Here is my immediate concern...

You don't know if anything your friend says is accurate. The decision to fire somebody is not like it is in the private sector. There has to be a paper trail of incidents and conversations before a termination can be considered. In other words, if she has a feeling she is going to get fired, it's because she has had conversation with leadership multiple times about her performance. Also, most agencies have a Retention Board that looks at the probationary employees to determine if they are keepers. So it wouldn't be just one person's opinion.



thanks 1 user thanked BrownsFan for this useful post.
RightGuy45 on 4/19/2017(UTC)
birdonamission  
#11 Posted : Saturday, April 01, 2017 4:57:14 PM(UTC)

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 6/12/2010(UTC)
Posts: 539

Thanks: 16 times
Was thanked: 24 time(s) in 23 post(s)
Wait... Your friend only got hired since the freeze (Jan. 22) and is already on the brink of being terminated because of performance issues?

Effectively, you're saying all this happened in the space of one month -- if you consider she spent her first 30 days getting her badge, finding her way around, learning people's names, getting the IT stuff up and running, where to get lunch, etc. (not the least of which was having several conversations about the office, job duties, and what not).

And that month-long vacation you told her to take... (??)

What's really going on here?
Frankish  
#12 Posted : Sunday, April 02, 2017 8:05:54 AM(UTC)
FrankJr

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 6/15/2015(UTC)
Posts: 510
United States

Thanks: 53 times
Was thanked: 79 time(s) in 72 post(s)
The supervisor may be jerk. Endless employees with successful careers working for a jerk. The supervisor is new and is judged based on the success or failure of the employees or the supervisor. Upper management will give the new supervisor a long rope to hang oneself. Big difference between a threat of termination and termination. Quite a bit of odd information in the original post.
Spool_Up  
#13 Posted : Monday, April 03, 2017 3:47:50 PM(UTC)
Spool_Up

Rank: Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/12/2017(UTC)
Posts: 23
United States
Location: MI

Was thanked: 2 time(s) in 2 post(s)
2 months ago I was about to get terminated during probation.. I was 6 months in my new position as a intern GS-7 (1102 contract specialist) & probationary period is 2 years.. before that I was a GS-5 with a different agency for 13 months... My supervisor was crazy and found out I was looking for and interviewing for jobs outside of government. Long story short this was a buyers remorse for me because I wasn't happy at the current agency and was trying to go back to my prior agency...As soon as my supervisor found out the higher ups wanted to terminate for "poor job performance" So unfair because I was still learning the job & I was a transfer for a promotion.. As a result, management gave me the opportunity to resign instead. I recently received my new updated SF-50 in the mail and says reason for resignation "personal reasons" under block 45.

OP I know people that have "termination" on their SF-50's and found other federal jobs and reinstated..

Edited by user Monday, April 03, 2017 4:11:16 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

nightchop  
#14 Posted : Monday, April 03, 2017 4:27:51 PM(UTC)

Rank: Advisor

Groups: Registered
Joined: 12/29/2012(UTC)
Posts: 103

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 21 time(s) in 16 post(s)
I wouldn't resign if I didn't have anything else lined up and would keep collecting a check. You are in a good position in that you're in a probationary period. Either party can "terminate" the relationship during that period. This is something that is easily explained away in interviews. I never understand why people quit during probation. Why would you stop a steady income stream? Let them fire you. If you cannot find a way to overcome this in interviews, you have bigger problems.
ManagerialMan  
#15 Posted : Tuesday, April 04, 2017 2:24:27 AM(UTC)
ManagerialMan

Rank: Groupie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 1/21/2016(UTC)
Posts: 86
Man
United States

Thanks: 2 times
Was thanked: 18 time(s) in 14 post(s)
I've had an experience where an employee was extremely lack-luster in her work... and she got the union involved with her supervisor and coworkers to discuss a "solution." - Where everything BUT firing was discussed. The only difference was this individual was not on probation, so I don't know how this can/will help your friend.

But if your friend is really that miserable, is the job worth it? Who knows how long this freeze/attrition thing will last. She has to ask herself how bad she wants this.
thanks 1 user thanked ManagerialMan for this useful post.
RightGuy45 on 4/19/2017(UTC)
HERCULES ROCKAFELLAR  
#16 Posted : Wednesday, April 05, 2017 6:07:09 AM(UTC)
HERCULES ROCKAFELLAR

Rank: Groupie

Groups: Registered
Joined: 2/9/2008(UTC)
Posts: 55

Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
go to the union. This is the Federal Government, not private industry, supervisors can't be jerks to you for no reason, they will get in trouble.
thanks 1 user thanked HERCULES ROCKAFELLAR for this useful post.
RightGuy45 on 4/19/2017(UTC)
FedCivServ  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, April 05, 2017 12:52:12 PM(UTC)

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 9/9/2013(UTC)
Posts: 1,079

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 131 time(s) in 119 post(s)
That is why there is a probationary period...so you can see if the person is a good fit. Supervisors have a lot more leeway during that first year (or two now) in dismissing someone. If they have documentation, it's not hard to do.
thanks 1 user thanked for this useful post.
socGrad on 4/6/2017(UTC)
Spool_Up  
#18 Posted : Wednesday, April 05, 2017 12:52:49 PM(UTC)
Spool_Up

Rank: Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/12/2017(UTC)
Posts: 23
United States
Location: MI

Was thanked: 2 time(s) in 2 post(s)
If I were the OP's friend I would resign... you can always apply for other Federal jobs and be reinstated.. However, I know terminated Federal Employees that were able to land other gigs. But IMO your chances are always better if your gonna resign.. ppl resign all the time but you more than likely won't collect unemployment...
nightchop  
#19 Posted : Wednesday, April 05, 2017 1:42:32 PM(UTC)

Rank: Advisor

Groups: Registered
Joined: 12/29/2012(UTC)
Posts: 103

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 21 time(s) in 16 post(s)
Originally Posted by: Spool_Up Go to Quoted Post
you more than likely won't collect unemployment...


Exactly. Unless you have another job lined up, it would be foolish to resign for this reason alone. I know managers who make employees think they'll be fired so the employee will leave on his or her own. You just make it easy for the employer when you do that. Things can change. If an employee feels they will be fired during probation, they should start job hunting ASAP. Keep earning an income while you look for another job. Make the supervisor justify the firing to their superiors and HR. A termination during probation is the best type of termination. No way I'd quit without another job lined up.
socGrad  
#20 Posted : Thursday, April 06, 2017 9:44:16 AM(UTC)
socGrad

Rank: Senior Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 7/1/2013(UTC)
Posts: 283

Thanks: 59 times
Was thanked: 13 time(s) in 13 post(s)
"Also, she never loses her time in service. It is always counted if she's re-hired."


Does this apply to time towards career status or only time towards leave/retirement?

Also, does management need a paper trail if a person is on probation? I thought people on probation (like me) were "at will" hires during their probationary period...
Rss Feed  Atom Feed
Users browsing this topic
Guest (2)
2 Pages12>
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.


This page was generated in 2.298 seconds.