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The Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) is an agency of the United States Department of Justice that serves as both a federal criminal investigative body and an internal intelligence agency. The FBI has investigative jurisdiction over violations of more than 200 categories of federal crime.

Headquartered in Washington, DC, the FBI has over 55 field offices located throughout the USA as well as smaller units throughout the world.

Perhaps you are working for the FBI or interested in working for the FBI. Here is a forum to share your experience with the FBI.

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ladybee27  
#1 Posted : Monday, June 24, 2019 1:49:44 PM(UTC)
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So today I was was informed unofficially that I didnt do well on my poly, which honestly I'm disappointed about, especially since I know that I was honest and forthcoming about everything🙁. In the past I know people were allowed to appeal the poly for a retest.. but I was also informed as of March 2019 they no longer grant appeals. Anyone know why?
TheSecDev  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, June 25, 2019 5:24:30 PM(UTC)
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What you should be asking / finding out is if it disqualifies you permanently. The website doesn't list failing the polygraph as a disqualifier but the Special Agency Selection Process guide does.

From the Guide: "Previously failed the FBI polygraph examination or was disqualified for employment with the FBI during a background investigation"

So the question is, which one is it? Is the website correct or the guide?
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FBI_Prospect  
#3 Posted : Wednesday, June 26, 2019 2:38:22 PM(UTC)
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Where did you hear that they no longer grant polygraph appeals ? I was never aware of this alleged policy change.
The polygraph appeals timeline is pretty well established and many candidates on here are in the process of appealing their polygraph results, whether or not they are willing to publicly acknowledge it,since the failure rate is so high (40-50%), any additional information on this opaque process is definitely welcome.

Edited by user Wednesday, June 26, 2019 2:39:24 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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BudgetRyder on 6/26/2019(UTC)
ladybee27  
#4 Posted : Wednesday, June 26, 2019 7:21:14 PM(UTC)
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I took my poly May 17, 2019, didnt hear anything. I reached out to my investigator a few days ago, he instructed me to reach out to HR. The individual from HR got back me by email..stated that she reached out to FBIHQ, that I didnt do well on my poly and should be receiving notice in the mail within the next few weeks. In her email she also stated that as of March of 2019 appeals are no longer granted.

Edited by user Thursday, June 27, 2019 10:32:03 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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George Maschke on 6/27/2019(UTC)
George Maschke  
#5 Posted : Thursday, June 27, 2019 10:07:13 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ladybee27 Go to Quoted Post
So today I was was informed unofficially that I didnt do well on my poly, which honestly I'm disappointed about, especially since I know that I was honest and forthcoming about everything🙁. In the past I know people were allowed to appeal the poly for a retest.. but I was also informed as of March 2019 they no longer grant appeals. Anyone know why?


Note that FBI "re-tests" have always been a sham, intended to create only the appearance of fairness.

Edited by user Thursday, June 27, 2019 10:18:05 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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George Maschke  
#6 Posted : Thursday, June 27, 2019 10:13:17 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ladybee27 Go to Quoted Post
I took my poly May 19, 2019, didnt hear anything. I reached out to my investigator a few days ago, he instructed me to reach out to HR. The individual from HR got back me by email..stated that she reached out to FBIHQ, that I didnt do well on my poly and should be receiving notice in the mail within the next few weeks. In her email she also stated that as of March of 2019 appeals are no longer granted.


Assuming you answered the relevant questions truthfully, and the letter you receive states that your polygraph results were "not within acceptable parameters," you will want to send the FBI a letter contesting the polygraph results. This will document the fact that you don't silently accept the polygraph operator's accusation that you lied. See Chapter 5 of The Lie Behind the Lie Detector for more on how to mitigate the career harm that failing the polygraph will cause.
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ladybee27  
#7 Posted : Friday, June 28, 2019 12:57:40 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: George Maschke Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: ladybee27 Go to Quoted Post
I took my poly May 19, 2019, didnt hear anything. I reached out to my investigator a few days ago, he instructed me to reach out to HR. The individual from HR got back me by email..stated that she reached out to FBIHQ, that I didnt do well on my poly and should be receiving notice in the mail within the next few weeks. In her email she also stated that as of March of 2019 appeals are no longer granted.


Assuming you answered the relevant questions truthfully, and the letter you receive states that your polygraph results were "not within acceptable parameters," you will want to send the FBI a letter contesting the polygraph results. This will document the fact that you don't silently accept the polygraph operator's accusation that you lied. See Chapter 5 of The Lie Behind the Lie Detector for more on how to mitigate the career harm that failing the polygraph will cause.


I havent gotten my letter yet, I was informed via email by my HR POC after requesting an update.
George Maschke  
#8 Posted : Friday, August 16, 2019 6:57:18 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: FBI_Prospect Go to Quoted Post
I can now personally confirm that the FBI polygraph "appeals process" is nothing more than a sham. One that the FBI are allegedly doing away with moving forward.
Long story, short...I had to reach out to my local office about the status of my appeal after not hearing anything from them for over a year.
I received a reply saying they had allegedly sent a letter with a final appeal denial months ago...needless to say I didn't receive anything in the mail and was thoroughly dejected at their decision. This whole application process turned out to be nothing but a huge waste of my time and effort and it's easily the most negative "hiring" experience to date, doubly so in light of having breezed through all portions of the application process, from the Phase I exam to PFT (scoring 16 points on first attempt). It goes to show the FBI are throwing away quality candidates in favor of folks with limited life experience, no travel history and little relevant exposure to the 'real world', and all based on a glorified toaster with a blood monitor attached to it. Unfortunately for the FBI, it does reflect on the organization as a whole, cue any of the countless negative headlines and debacles from the last few years as proof. Anyways it's best to move on, and to the countless other lurkers on this forum who are in the same boat, I wish you all best of luck...Onward and Upwards.


If you would be willing to contribute a public statement about your FBI polygraph, I would be happy to include it on AntiPolygraph.org:

https://antipolygraph.org/statements.shtml

The third statement on the above-linked page is my own.
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Mp37376p  
#9 Posted : Monday, September 2, 2019 5:58:43 PM(UTC)
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According to the Honors Internship Application:

"If you fail the polygraph because you withheld information about illegal drug use, criminal activity, or any other violation, you will be automatically disqualified from this and ALL future employment with the FBI. Also, failing the polygraph or background investigation will likely negatively affect future employment opportunities with the U.S. Intelligence Community and with any other agency of the federal government."

Now, you say:

"I know that I was honest and forthcoming about everything."

I doubt that. Deception is indicated when the examinee’s Autonomic Nerv­ous System displays a significant and repetitive “defensive” reaction to one or more of the rele­vant test questions. Although this reaction in itself in not a “lie,” years of research has shown that 90 to 95 percent of the examinees who display this reaction were either lying to the relevant test questions or was withholding pertinent information relating to the relevant test questions. The current polygraph research indicates that when a polygraph exam, conducted by a qualified, trained, and experienced polygraph examiner, is properly administered the accuracy rate is between 95% and 98%. The polygraph is the most accurate tool available today for determining truth or deception. While the polygraph technique is highly accurate, it is not infallible and errors can occur, polygraph errors may be caused by the examiner’s failure to properly prepare the examine for the examination, or by a misreading of the physiological data on the polygraph charts. Since it is recognized that any error is damaging, examiners utilize a variety of procedures to identify the presence of factors which may cause false responses, and to insure an unbiased review of the polygraph records.

These Protective Procedures include:

An assessment of the examinee’s emotional state.
Medical information about the examinee’s physical condition.
Specialized tests to identify the overly responsive examinee and to calm the overly nervous.
Control questions to evaluate the examinee’s response capabilities.
Factual analysis of the case information.
A pre-test interview and detailed review of the questions.
Quality control reviews.


While the polygraph technique is not infallible, research clearly indicates that when administered by a competent examiner the polygraph test is the most accurate means available to determine truth and deception. Since 1980, a compendium of research studies - encompassing 80 research projects involving 6,380 polygraph examinations and 12 studies of the validity of field examinations following 2,174 field examinations, indicate an average accuracy rate of 98%. The FBI selects polygraph examiners from among its Special Agent workforce. Candidates must have at least 5 years of FBI investigative experience and demonstrated success as an interviewer, interrogator, and case agent in complex investigations. Candidates must also have the ability to perform well under stress and in confrontational situations. Prior to selection, examiner candidates must undergo a personnel security polygraph examination.

Candidates with prior experience at conducting polygraph examinations must have completed a basic polygraph course at a polygraph school approved by the FBI or certified by the American Polygraph Association. Candidates who are not experienced examiners or do not have training from an approved school are sent to DoDPI’s 14-week course for examiner trainees. After graduation from the DoDPI course, new examiners are mentored by a senior examiner during a supervised internship. New examiners receive 1 week of specialized training in the Polygraph Unit, and their first 12 examinations are monitored by a senior examiner. Examiners who successfully complete all required training and a 1-year internship, during which they complete at least 48 polygraph examinations, are certified by the FBI. FBI examiners are required to complete at least 48 polygraph examinations a year to maintain their certification. They also must complete a minimum of 80 hours of polygraph-related training every 2 years as part of their continuing education. Because of the extensive training provided to new FBI examiners, they are expected to serve for a minimum of 3 years.

As of December 2005, the FBI Polygraph Unit’s supervisory personnel had an average of 18 years of investigative experience and an average of 9 years of polygraph experience. Field examiners had an average of 17 years of investigative experience and 9 years of polygraph experience.

While I cannot speak to individual experiences, most who fail withhold information (whether minor or otherwise) during the polygraph examination.

As for why the policy has changed, more than likely its due to the recommendations of the OIG in its evaluation of the FBI's Polygraph program.

"The polygraph appeals timeline is pretty well established and many candidates on here are in the process of appealing their polygraph results, whether or not they are willing to publicly acknowledge it,since the failure rate is so high (40-50%), any additional information on this opaque process is definitely welcome."


The Failure rate is also not 40%-50%. An OIG Report from 2005 found that only 24% of Polygraph results had the result of Deception Indicated. I doubt that number has risen since then, considering the process has only improved since.

"It goes to show the FBI are throwing away quality candidates in favor of folks with limited life experience, no travel history and little relevant exposure to the 'real world', and all based on a glorified toaster with a blood monitor attached to it."

That "Glorified Toaster" has a 98% accuracy rate with a qualified examiner administering the exam, and as i've explained above, FBI examiners are highly trained, and there is even more oversight in the process that I haven't even described. If you wanted to work for the FBI, you probably shouldn't have withheld information or lied to your examiner, because trust me, they can tell when you're being deceptive. In all honesty, its probably best that neither of you are working in a National Security position. Conduct involving questionable judgment, lack of candor, dishonesty, or unwillingness to comply with rules and regulations can raise questions about an individual's eligibility, trustworthiness, and ability to protect classified or sensitive information. Of special interest is any failure to cooperate or provide truthful and candid answers during national security investigative or adjudicative processes.

The Federal Bureau of Investigation has a vital mission — to protect and defend the United States against terrorist and foreign intelligence threats and to respond to criminal threats facing the country. This mission demands that the FBI be vigilant in its stewardship of sensitive information, systems, and spaces. The FBI uses polygraph examinations as one of many tools to assess whether job applicants and employees pose a national security risk or are unsuitable for FBI employment


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1995JeepCherokee on 9/20/2019(UTC)
ladybee27  
#10 Posted : Monday, September 2, 2019 7:03:31 PM(UTC)
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You're entitled to your OPINION as we all are. As I said before I KNOW that I was honest about everything. I've moved on. I will FOREVER think polygraphs are not a useful tool after my process. No drug use history, no criminal background, currently holding a security clearance in a federal position...taken other polys that were a lot more intrusive and passed. I dont discourage anyone from pursuing a career with the FBI, it's a great career,just dont be surprised if you fail a poly while being 100% honest.

No bitterness here. It's wasn't the end of the world.
Mp37376p  
#11 Posted : Monday, September 2, 2019 9:53:08 PM(UTC)
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"As I said before I KNOW that I was honest about everything."

Some examinees will “fail” a polygraph test even though they are telling the literal truth, but they continue to hold back pertinent or incriminating information from the examiner. Minor or otherwise. Deception is indicated when your autonomic Nervous System displays a significant and repetitive “defensive” reaction to one or more of the relevant test questions. Although this reaction in itself in not a “lie,” years of research has shown that 90 to 95 percent of the examiners who display this reaction were either lying to the relevant test questions or was withholding pertinent information relating to the relevant test questions.Remember, 99% of the truth is still a lie.

"No drug use history, no criminal background, currently holding a security clearance in a federal position...taken other polys that were a lot more intrusive and passed. I dont discourage anyone from pursuing a career with the FBI, it's a great career,just dont be surprised if you fail a poly while being 100% honest."

You can be "honest" and still fail if you withhold information. This is why your nervous system produced a Defensive reaction to the questions asked, that means either a, you were lying, or b, you were withholding information, even if you think its minor, you have to disclose it. Again, 99% of the truth is still a lie. Is it possible to fail a poly while being honest and not withholding information? Sure, but cases like that are rare, especially since FBI examiners are highly qualified and there is plenty of oversight in the process. The worst that would likely happen is an Inconclusive result, which would mean you'd get retested.

"For some "wet-behind-the-ears" college student with no work or life experience you sure like to throw around a lot of meaningless opinions disguised as facts, esp regarding polygraph data."

I do have work experience, which if you've been checking out my page, you'd know that I've interned with a 3 letter agency this past summer. Everything I've provided in the above response is fact.

"Care to cite your sources, other than some outdated, 14-year old government "report"?"

Sure:

https://oig.justice.gov/...rts/plus/e0608/final.pdf

https://oig.justice.gov/reports/2018/e1802.pdf

https://oig.justice.gov/press/2018/2018-03-29.pdf

Based on twelve separate studies involving 2174 real cases since 1980, evidence suggests that qualified field polygraph examiners are 98 percent accurate in their overall decisions (Norman Ansley, "The validity and reliability of polygraph decisions in real cases", Polygraph, v.19, 1990). Research clearly indicates that when administered by a competent polygraph examiner, the polygraph test is the most accurate means available to determine truth and deception.

"Furthermore, I'd hate to break it to you but any TS security clearance you already think you have won't transfer over to the FBI, so they may very well find your "perfectly honest" answers lacking during your application/ polygraph process"

I already have a TS/SCI Clearance. From what i've researched, it could transfer over, especially since i've already taken a Full Scope Poly. But if I need to retake the Poly Again, so be it, i'd need to retake it periodically every 5 years if I were to get accepted into the Bureau regardless. The 35,000 Employees in the FBI don't seem to have an issue with the Polygraph, neither do thousands of Individuals in the Intelligence Community, the Military and even Cops from Police Departments from across the country. I have no concern over failing the Polygraph if I were to get the honor of receiving an offer, considering that I will follow instructions of my examiner and be forthcoming when asked to provide information, I won't withhold information, whether minor or otherwise. If I were to fail the Polygraph because I lied or withheld information, I would accept accountability by accepting responsibility for my actions and decisions, and the consequences of my actions and decisions.
George Maschke  
#12 Posted : Tuesday, September 3, 2019 3:38:32 AM(UTC)
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With respect to the accuracy of polygraphy, it's worth noting that it hasn't been proven through peer-reviewed research to reliably work at better-than-chance levels of accuracy under field conditions.

It is wrong to suppose that because 35,000 FBI employees don't seem to have an issue with the polygraph, it must work and be highly accurate. Everyone who got a false positive on the pre-employment polygraph was systematically excluded from that population. Even then, there are documented instances where erroneous polygraph results have caused severe career harm to existing FBI employees. Cases that come to mind include:

Mark Mallah:

https://antipolygraph.or...ents/statement-002.shtml

Rita Chiang:

https://antipolygraph.or...lowing-failed-polygraph/

"Logan":

https://www.huffpost.com...57ffe22ce4b0162c043ae621
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ladybee27  
#13 Posted : Tuesday, September 3, 2019 3:39:35 AM(UTC)
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Polygraphs arent amissable in courts for a reason. I'll leave it at that...my guess is you may or may not be someone that works for the FBI or administers them. We all know that polys are bull*****, however we take them anyway because it's a requirement in the career paths that we chose. Even a FBI recruiter stated (off the record) that it was odd that a certain field office which I wont mention, was seeing a high level of failures, in particular from minorities.

Edited by user Tuesday, September 3, 2019 3:41:03 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Mp37376p  
#14 Posted : Tuesday, September 3, 2019 8:07:36 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ladybee27 Go to Quoted Post
Polygraphs arent amissable in courts for a reason. I'll leave it at that...my guess is you may or may not be someone that works for the FBI or administers them. We all know that polys are bull*****, however we take them anyway because it's a requirement in the career paths that we chose. Even a FBI recruiter stated (off the record) that it was odd that a certain field office which I wont mention, was seeing a high level of failures, in particular from minorities.


Originally Posted by: ladybee27 Go to Quoted Post
Polygraphs arent amissable in courts for a reason. I'll leave it at that...my guess is you may or may not be someone that works for the FBI or administers them. We all know that polys are bull*****, however we take them anyway because it's a requirement in the career paths that we chose. Even a FBI recruiter stated (off the record) that it was odd that a certain field office which I wont mention, was seeing a high level of failures, in particular from minorities.


Contrary to popular belief, polygraph results are not per se inadmissible in most courts across the country. The states of New Mexico and Ohio have allowed Polygraph to be admitted, even over objection of the opposing party.

The Supreme Court has left it up to individual jurisdictions to allow or disallow the use of polygraph examinations. There are only four (4) states that have a total ban on admitting polygraph results. Most states allow them if both the plaintiff and the defendant have agreed (stipulated) that the results of the test will be admissible prior to the examination being conducted. They are admitted more frequently in civil trials than criminal trials. For more details on admissibility and case citations for each state, click here.

Polygraph results are admissible in some federal circuit courts and some states. More often, polygraph results are admissible when the parties have agreed to their admissibility under terms of a stipulation. Some jurisdictions have absolute bans on admissibility of polygraph results as evidence and even the suggestion that a polygraph examination is involved is sufficient to cause a retrial. The United States Supreme Court has yet to rule on the issue of admissibility, so the rules in federal circuits vary considerably. As time goes on, more and more jurisdictions are tending toward accepting polygraph evidence

Federal courts have ruled that polygraph is NOT per-se inadmissible in a court procedure, but that it may be considered when standard rules of scientific evidence have been met. In other words, applicants must apply to the judge for admissibility under the "Daubert" standard of evidence on a case-by-case basis. Individual judges can still decline to accept polygraph results, however. Each jurisdiction must be checked to determine admissibility standards. One of the greatest fears keeping polygraph evidence out of courts is the fact that such evidence would carry greater weight than other equally-important evidence and would tend to sway a jury in one direction even though other evidence may point the other way. In most cases, polygraph evidence is used during pre-trial negotiations and plea bargain agreements rather than during the trial itself.

On December 23, 2014 an Order was issued via United States District Court, Middle District of Florida, Tampa Division Case No. 8:14-cr-379-T-36TGW. United States of America v. Jesus Hernando Angulo Mosquera. The Order requested an evidentiary hearing regarding the admissibility of polygraph evidence. After considering the motion the court ruled to permit the polygraph evidence at trial.

The FBI is an Equal Opportunity Employer. All qualified applicants will receive consideration. Except where otherwise provided by law, selection will be made without regard to, and there will be no discrimination because of race, religion, color, national origin, sex, political affiliations, marital status, non-disqualifying physical or mental disability, age, sexual orientation, gender identity, genetic information, membership or non-membership in an employee organization, or on the basis of personal favoritism or other non-merit factors. If minorities were frequently failing the Polygraph exam, that means they were either withholding information or lying to the examiners.

Recent research reveals that the accuracy of the new computerized polygraph system is close to 100 percent. In the past 75 years, over 250 studies have been conducted on the validity, accuracy and reliability of polygraph testing (American Polygraph Association 1996 Polygraph Issues & Answers). Based on twelve separate studies involving 2174 real cases since 1980, evidence suggests that qualified field polygraph examiners are 98 percent accurate in their overall decisions (Norman Ansley, "The validity and reliability of polygraph decisions in real cases", Polygraph, v.19, 1990). Research clearly indicates that when administered by a competent polygraph examiner, the polygraph test is the most accurate means available to determine truth and deception.



Mp37376p  
#15 Posted : Tuesday, September 3, 2019 8:45:45 AM(UTC)
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Orwell once said "In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act".


As a matter of fact, it did yield a job offer, just not with the FBI.

I'm not saying anyone here lied, i'm simply saying that withholding information, minor or otherwise can also cause your Central Nervous System to emit the same Defensive response as if you were lying. Years of Research has indicated that 90%-95% of the time, those who emit a Defensive Response are either lying or withholding information from the Examiner. Just because you think something may be minor doesn't mean you don't disclose it, all it takes is one Defensive Response for you to "fail" the examination. 99% of the truth is still a lie.

That "Government Report" is the only verifiable public information we know about the FBI's Polygraph Program.

Contrary to popular belief, polygraph results are not per se inadmissible in most courts across the country. The states of New Mexico and Ohio have allowed Polygraph to be admitted, even over objection of the opposing party.

The Supreme Court has left it up to individual jurisdictions to allow or disallow the use of polygraph examinations. There are only four (4) states that have a total ban on admitting polygraph results. Most states allow them if both the plaintiff and the defendant have agreed (stipulated) that the results of the test will be admissible prior to the examination being conducted. They are admitted more frequently in civil trials than criminal trials. For more details on admissibility and case citations for each state, click here.

Polygraph results are admissible in some federal circuit courts and some states. More often, polygraph results are admissible when the parties have agreed to their admissibility under terms of a stipulation. Some jurisdictions have absolute bans on admissibility of polygraph results as evidence and even the suggestion that a polygraph examination is involved is sufficient to cause a retrial. The United States Supreme Court has yet to rule on the issue of admissibility, so the rules in federal circuits vary considerably. As time goes on, more and more jurisdictions are tending toward accepting polygraph evidence

Federal courts have ruled that polygraph is NOT per-se inadmissible in a court procedure, but that it may be considered when standard rules of scientific evidence have been met. In other words, applicants must apply to the judge for admissibility under the "Daubert" standard of evidence on a case-by-case basis. Individual judges can still decline to accept polygraph results, however. Each jurisdiction must be checked to determine admissibility standards. One of the greatest fears keeping polygraph evidence out of courts is the fact that such evidence would carry greater weight than other equally-important evidence and would tend to sway a jury in one direction even though other evidence may point the other way. In most cases, polygraph evidence is used during pre-trial negotiations and plea bargain agreements rather than during the trial itself.

On December 23, 2014 an Order was issued via United States District Court, Middle District of Florida, Tampa Division Case No. 8:14-cr-379-T-36TGW. United States of America v. Jesus Hernando Angulo Mosquera. The Order requested an evidentiary hearing regarding the admissibility of polygraph evidence. After considering the motion the court ruled to permit the polygraph evidence at trial.

I'll take the word of multiple Scientific Studies over your anecdotal claims. And I haven't said they are 98% accurate. What I said was **qualified** field polygraph examiners are 98 percent accurate in their overall decisions. Research clearly indicates that when administered by a **competent polygraph examiner**, the polygraph test is the most accurate means available to determine truth and deception.

Yes, because lets take the word of absolute strangers over the Internet as absolute fact and truth, that they were not lying or withholding information from the examiner. Because people on the Internet never lie right? If they lied or withheld information from their examiner, their probably withholding information or lying to you too.

I'm sorry, but I don't exactly trust your "personal observations". I prefer to deal with Verifiable Information, the only Verifiable Public Information we know about the FBI's Polygraph Program comes from the 2006 OIG Report "Use of Polygraph Examinations in the Department of Justice", which based out of 23,310 Pre Employment cases from 2002-2005, determined that there was no deceptive indicated in 67% of cases, Deception Indicated in 24% and Inconclusive in 8% of them. Now unless you've submitted an FOIA to indicate the more recent numbers, i'm not going to trust your "observations" of 20 or so applicants.

Wrong Again about my TS/SCI not transferring over. Now according to the State Department: "Federal agencies will normally accept another agency's investigation as the basis for granting a security clearance, provided your last security clearance investigation was completed within the past 5 years for a Top Secret clearance and 10 years for a Secret clearance, and you have not had a break in service of more than 2 years. Also considered is whether there have been any significant changes in your situation since your last investigation. Some federal agencies might have additional investigative or adjudicative requirements that must be met prior to their accepting a clearance granted by another agency."

https://2009-2017.state..../clearances/c10977.htm#7

FBI Polygraph's are full scope, and the FBI has different Suitability standards compared to other Police Departments. Not sure what you're trying to prove here. But again, the science tells us that if they failed, they were either lying or withholding pertinent information from their examiner. If someone lies on the Polygraph or withholds pertinent information, they could be lying about their candor during the exam. Don't blindly believe the words of strangers over the Internet. A Bit of Skepticism is always warranted.

11,500 Applications is not exactly "struggling". Especially for only around 500-700 Spots. The first article simply is describing what the FBI has always do, recruit a diverse group of backgrounds, doesn't even mention the Polygraph. The Second Article is simply individuals leaving to the Private Sector for higher paying jobs, nothing to do with the Polygraph. The fact that you'd quote the Intercept is laughable, but again nothing to do with the Polygraph.

The Federal Bureau of Investigation has a vital mission — to protect and defend the United States against terrorist and foreign intelligence threats and to respond to criminal threats facing the country. This mission demands that the FBI be vigilant in its stewardship of sensitive information, systems, and spaces. The FBI uses polygraph examinations as one of many tools to assess whether job applicants and employees pose a national security risk or are unsuitable for FBI employment.










ladybee27  
#16 Posted : Tuesday, September 3, 2019 9:07:36 AM(UTC)
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If polygraphs were that reliable there wouldnt be any controversy about it's use. You can quote copy/paste whatever info ..however we all KNOW that polygraphs are not a good vetting tool. Otherwise there would be ZERO questions about it's use.
someoldguy  
#17 Posted : Tuesday, September 3, 2019 11:04:31 AM(UTC)
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I don't know about FBI but other agencies have a very high "inconclusive" rate on the first try and an equally high "pass" rate on the second try (that is, returning to take the whole thing over again at a later date). I know one guy who said he was basically accused of being a lying drug-dealing terrorist during the first exam. At the end of the second exam, the polygrapher said nothing. My friend finally got up the nerve to blurt out, "So, how was it?" The polygrapher said, "Fine, no problems."

What happened to the drug-dealing terrorist?

Edited by user Tuesday, September 3, 2019 11:06:32 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

DISCLAIMER: You read it on an open internet forum :)
Mp37376p  
#18 Posted : Tuesday, September 3, 2019 2:17:26 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ladybee27 Go to Quoted Post
If polygraphs were that reliable there wouldnt be any controversy about it's use. You can quote copy/paste whatever info ..however we all KNOW that polygraphs are not a good vetting tool. Otherwise there would be ZERO questions about it's use.


Everything is controversial nowadays, welcome to 2019. I prefer to believe Scientific Evidence and studies over your anecdotal evidence.

As Benjamin Franklin said

“Being ignorant is not so much a shame, as being unwilling to learn.”
ladybee27  
#19 Posted : Tuesday, September 3, 2019 2:31:52 PM(UTC)
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Lol there have been just as many studies that prove that dont do not work. If a human cant detect with 100% certainty when a person is being deceitful, you really believe that a machine can? If you choose to be that naive, so be it. There's a story somewhere online of a former law enforcement official with your same mentality until he was wrongfully accused of being deceitful.

You can speak on your biased "scientific research" however, my FACTUAL informations comes from my PERSONAL EXPERIENCE with the polygraph process. You're accusing someone you know nothing about of being a liar. Your strong defensiveness of said "technology" sounds borderline psychotic.
Mp37376p  
#20 Posted : Tuesday, September 3, 2019 2:32:24 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: someoldguy Go to Quoted Post
I don't know about FBI but other agencies have a very high "inconclusive" rate on the first try and an equally high "pass" rate on the second try (that is, returning to take the whole thing over again at a later date). I know one guy who said he was basically accused of being a lying drug-dealing terrorist during the first exam. At the end of the second exam, the polygrapher said nothing. My friend finally got up the nerve to blurt out, "So, how was it?" The polygrapher said, "Fine, no problems."

What happened to the drug-dealing terrorist?


From the OIG Report from 2002-2005 data, the FBI had an inconclusive rate of 8%. CBP in another OIG Report from 2013-2016 had an Inconclusive rate of 5%. So Inconclusive Results don't appear to be all too common. The Exam itself is limited to yes or no questions, every test conducted goes through a quality control process. Only after that quality control process is completed can official results be provided. All FBI Polygraph Examiners are federally certified and held to strict guidelines and standards governed by the National Center for Credibility Assessment. FBI Polygraph Examiners work hard to provide each applicant with a fair and accurate examination; however, applicants must be forthcoming and cooperative in order to successfully complete the polygraph examination.
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