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BlessinInDaSkies  
#1 Posted : Monday, January 13, 2020 9:36:22 AM(UTC)
BlessinInDaSkies

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Even with a law degree from a top school, I'm having trouble determining if a J.D. is considered to meet the educational requirements of GS-9 or GS-11.

I'm NOT looking for an attorney position (0905), but rather would like to get into another field in the competitive service.

A law degree is typically three full years of progressively higher level graduate education, completing 88-90 semester hours, more than enough for GS-11.

I have been referred for 9 on some postings and not referred for 11, and been referred for both on some postings.

I'm a 10 pt vet, and a military spouse in the DC area with a decade of experience prior to law school and I can't get an interview.

This was my favorite rejection, I'm not even sure how it's possible.

"By law, veterans receive preference over non-veteran applicants in the hiring process. For this position, there were qualified veterans who must be considered first; therefore, your application was not reviewed for this position. Your veteran status is: CPS - 10-point preference based on a compensable service-connected disability of 30 percent or more."

Any help would be appreciated, thank you!
nembamike  
#2 Posted : Monday, January 13, 2020 10:22:41 AM(UTC)

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Was always under the impression that a BS or BA was good for a GS-9 and above that an GS-11. It should state in the announcement what education requirements satisfy that particular grade. Good luck.
Endless Summer  
#3 Posted : Monday, January 13, 2020 10:59:17 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: BlessinInDaSkies Go to Quoted Post
Even with a law degree from a top school, I'm having trouble determining if a J.D. is considered to meet the educational requirements of GS-9 or GS-11.

I'm NOT looking for an attorney position (0905), but rather would like to get into another field in the competitive service.

A law degree is typically three full years of progressively higher level graduate education, completing 88-90 semester hours, more than enough for GS-11.

I have been referred for 9 on some postings and not referred for 11, and been referred for both on some postings.

I'm a 10 pt vet, and a military spouse in the DC area with a decade of experience prior to law school and I can't get an interview.

This was my favorite rejection, I'm not even sure how it's possible.

"By law, veterans receive preference over non-veteran applicants in the hiring process. For this position, there were qualified veterans who must be considered first; therefore, your application was not reviewed for this position. Your veteran status is: CPS - 10-point preference based on a compensable service-connected disability of 30 percent or more."

Any help would be appreciated, thank you!


You are a 10 point vet and a military spouse. What is your 10 years experience in? I'd start looking at what positions you could get with either the 10 years experience or a blend of exp and education. You should easily qualify for an 11-12 position. The education is just icing on the cake.

There are lots of law school grads who don't practice law. What do you want to do?
King_Fed  
#4 Posted : Monday, January 13, 2020 4:48:59 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: BlessinInDaSkies Go to Quoted Post
Even with a law degree from a top school, I'm having trouble determining if a J.D. is considered to meet the educational requirements of GS-9 or GS-11.

I'm NOT looking for an attorney position (0905), but rather would like to get into another field in the competitive service.

A law degree is typically three full years of progressively higher level graduate education, completing 88-90 semester hours, more than enough for GS-11.

I have been referred for 9 on some postings and not referred for 11, and been referred for both on some postings.

I'm a 10 pt vet, and a military spouse in the DC area with a decade of experience prior to law school and I can't get an interview.

This was my favorite rejection, I'm not even sure how it's possible.

"By law, veterans receive preference over non-veteran applicants in the hiring process. For this position, there were qualified veterans who must be considered first; therefore, your application was not reviewed for this position. Your veteran status is: CPS - 10-point preference based on a compensable service-connected disability of 30 percent or more."

Any help would be appreciated, thank you!


Forget about the 10 pt vet thing... trust me (I'm a vet). As I said earlier this week, being a 10 or 30% vet won't mean anything if your experience is not related to the job, your resume looks like crap, you are not treating your USAjob search as a job. Putting out over 100 applications is not unheard of....

I'm not saying anything bad about you, your resume, etc... what I'm saying is look at those things and see if you can improve. For example, I could not get anyone to interview (and hire) me until I received free resume help when going from 11 to 12.

Heck, have you thought (if you have related experience) you should be looking for a GS-12 or even 13? I met a guy on my job who started off (and still is) a GS 14.

Look around at things that are not obvious and make changes. Let the vet preference work itself but work like you don't have it.

Edited by user Monday, January 13, 2020 4:50:19 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

thanks 1 user thanked King_Fed for this useful post.
Endless Summer on 1/14/2020(UTC)
djp  
#5 Posted : Monday, January 13, 2020 5:43:34 PM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: BlessinInDaSkies Go to Quoted Post
Even with a law degree from a top school, I'm having trouble determining if a J.D. is considered to meet the educational requirements of GS-9 or GS-11.

I'm NOT looking for an attorney position (0905), but rather would like to get into another field in the competitive service.

A law degree is typically three full years of progressively higher level graduate education, completing 88-90 semester hours, more than enough for GS-11.

I have been referred for 9 on some postings and not referred for 11, and been referred for both on some postings.

I'm a 10 pt vet, and a military spouse in the DC area with a decade of experience prior to law school and I can't get an interview.

This was my favorite rejection, I'm not even sure how it's possible.

"By law, veterans receive preference over non-veteran applicants in the hiring process. For this position, there were qualified veterans who must be considered first; therefore, your application was not reviewed for this position. Your veteran status is: CPS - 10-point preference based on a compensable service-connected disability of 30 percent or more."

Any help would be appreciated, thank you!


GS 11 should be entry point for a law degree because it’s phD equivalent with 3 yrs post bachelors education

The boiler statement you got could be because they only considered the top 3.

Spousal preference is a different appointment authority and can’t be combined withveteran ones

There could be issues in your resume.



Endless Summer  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2020 3:06:34 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: King_Fed Go to Quoted Post
...
Forget about the 10 pt vet thing... trust me (I'm a vet). As I said earlier this week, being a 10 or 30% vet won't mean anything if your experience is not related to the job, your resume looks like crap, you are not treating your USAjob search as a job. Putting out over 100 applications is not unheard of....

I'm not saying anything bad about you, your resume, etc... what I'm saying is look at those things and see if you can improve. For example, I could not get anyone to interview (and hire) me until I received free resume help when going from 11 to 12.

Heck, have you thought (if you have related experience) you should be looking for a GS-12 or even 13? I met a guy on my job who started off (and still is) a GS 14.

Look around at things that are not obvious and make changes. Let the vet preference work itself but work like you don't have it.


Yeah, the vet thing isn't the automatic open door that many think it is.

I had over 100 applications in before I got my first fed job, it really is a numbers game. Is your resume in USAJobs format? I think that's important. I have been on hiring boards and it was a real PITA to filter through a non-standard resume to make sure we were capturing everything.

You shouldn't be wasting your time applying for GS 9 positions, I know 9's who I'm convinced can't dress themselves in the morning and never made it past the 3rd grade. I could say the same about some 13's but it's a much smaller percentage.

Take stock of what your experience is, choose a place where you might want to live and look at every opening in that area. You will see jobs that you might never have considered, but you are qualified for. Apply, apply, apply...

Good luck
frankgonzalez  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2020 4:59:29 AM(UTC)
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1st thing...Vet pref isn't a panacea for a bad resume.
2nd thing, VEOA and VRA are better friends for vets than vet preference. Being able to apply to internal (as in need to be a fed) announcements is a greater benefit than 5 or 10 points. Smaller pool, and a good resume gets you looked at. I got in via VEOA twice..first time into the excepted service (DCIPS) and the 2nd time was into the competitive service as there was no interchange agreement between DCIPS and GS unless you had already been GS prior to going into DCIPS.
3rd...Resume, Resume, Resume. This is the main reason people are cut by HR or the selecting official. Poor grammar, misspellings, etc along with not telling me what you did and the results (and what you can bring to the table for my organization) can get you put on the discard pile pretty quickly. I have sent back a cert without interviewing anyone and started over. Candidates on the cert of eligibles included people with grad degrees (including JDs, LLMs and a PhD) simply because the resumes were lousy! I presume they may have been able to do the job, but if this is their first impression with us and it is this bad...what will they be like if we give them the job? I have also advised on not making a selection after interviews, only to have the selecting official make a selection...and then regret it a few months later and I end up having to spend half my time (as the selecting official's deputy) dealing with this individual who didn't seem to want to do their job and didn't want to be in the location they were hired for (all of which were very clear in the announcement!).

If you want a review of your resume, PM me and I'll give you my work email (and there are others here who would also do it if you ask) and I'll give you feedback on it.
You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
thanks 1 user thanked frankgonzalez for this useful post.
Endless Summer on 1/14/2020(UTC)
Endless Summer  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2020 5:17:18 AM(UTC)
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Amen to focusing on the resume. That's all your prospective sup has to judge you by.

And grammar, spelling, and punctuation are an important part. People will say "You're just being the grammar police" to which my response is "No, I'm being a professional, and I am looking to hire professionals" Spellcheck doesn't catch everything.

It's an excellent idea to have someone look over your resume. We don't usually catch all of our own mistakes.
smithandjones  
#9 Posted : Tuesday, January 14, 2020 9:36:09 AM(UTC)

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Many years ago I was offered a position as GS-9 Attorney. I was able to convince them to hire me at the GS-11 level (needed to show one year of experience). In any event, GS-9 level attorney positions clearly still exist. Here is one listed on usajobs now:

https://www.usajobs.gov/...ob/ViewDetails/555956200

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