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senpainft  
#1 Posted : Sunday, May 17, 2020 8:48:46 AM(UTC)
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Hello all,
A little background, I am 21 year old college student and am currently a pathways intern at the U.S. Forest Service in the business and industry role and thoroughly enjoy it..I believe there is a strong chance for conversion after I graduate in December and would love to work here. I also worked for the Census and interned at the Attorney General's office, so im no stranger to Government work. For financial reasons, I will save 10k on grad school assuming I attend immediately after i graduate in December, and I would gladly do so and work at the same time. I am stuck between three Masters, an MPA, MPP, or a Masters in Management from the Business school. Our MPA/MPP program is a top 10 in the Country whereas the MiM is top 30, however our Business school is a top business school in the country and the built in networking is phenomenal there. My question is this: I would love to stay in the public sector, but I do at some point want to move to the Houston area (its my dream town) where public sector jobs are just nowhere near as plentiful as private sector especially business...would you recommend sticking with public sector since my foot is already in the door, or getting out into private sector, and which Masters would you recommend? My undergrad is in Quant Sciences and dual majoring in Justice Studies with a minor in history.
someoldguy  
#2 Posted : Sunday, May 17, 2020 10:36:46 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
...or a Masters in Management from the Business school. Our MPA/MPP program is a top 10 in the Country whereas the MiM is top 30, however our Business school is a top business school in the country and the built in networking is phenomenal there.
What is a "Master's in Management" and how does it differ from an MBA? Does it matter? Anyway an MBA is a known entity, particularly if it comes from a highly regarded school.

DISCLAIMER: You read it on an open internet forum :)
senpainft  
#3 Posted : Sunday, May 17, 2020 10:43:17 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Unknown007 Go to Quoted Post
What is your promotion potential for your current job after conversion?


Speaking with others whom I work with who did the same, either GS9 or GS11
senpainft  
#4 Posted : Sunday, May 17, 2020 10:47:13 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: someoldguy Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
...or a Masters in Management from the Business school. Our MPA/MPP program is a top 10 in the Country whereas the MiM is top 30, however our Business school is a top business school in the country and the built in networking is phenomenal there.
What is a "Master's in Management" and how does it differ from an MBA? Does it matter? Anyway an MBA is a known entity, particularly if it comes from a highly regarded school.



A Masters in Management is, the best way i could put it, like a junior MBA. Whereas an MBA is usually closer to age 30, a MiM is closer to age 20. You don’t need work experience for it, like you do an MBA program (my school wants 3-5 years which would not line up with my 10k scholarship that has to be used the next year after my undergrad) which is what makes a MiM advantageous. You take coursework in Managerial accounting, finance, leadership, marketing etc.
djp  
#5 Posted : Sunday, May 17, 2020 12:16:44 PM(UTC)

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Why do you want yo go to Houston?

You can put in 3 yrs of service and earn status, leave, the come back to feds later.

In Houston there aren’t any big federal presence except for the oil and minerals area under interior dept minerals mamagrmrnt service.

Like other large citues they have
Federal courts
Social security
VA hospital
Some military base
National weather service office
Airport jobs
Some cities have some agency area or regional office.

Houston has one of the highest pay rates in the country

Houston has oil company hqs so oil industry regulatory jobs are likely in Houston along with gulf coast drilling regulatory agencies.
someoldguy  
#6 Posted : Sunday, May 17, 2020 12:52:10 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
A Masters in Management is, the best way i could put it, like a junior MBA. Whereas an MBA is usually closer to age 30, a MiM is closer to age 20. You don’t need work experience for it, like you do an MBA program
Yeah my friends who did high-powered MBA's had to have work experience before applying.

Here's a fun fact: for some reason Houston has one of the highest locality pay rates in the nation. Who knows why. I know some people who love Houston and wouldn't want to live anywhere else. Can't say I share the fascination....

DISCLAIMER: You read it on an open internet forum :)
senpainft  
#7 Posted : Sunday, May 17, 2020 1:11:39 PM(UTC)
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Thanks for the replies everyone. Many factors in why I want to move to Houston, but it is definitely something I’d like to do down the line. I can understand not doing a Masters since promotion potential is 9-11, but financially it would cost little to nothing (talking at most 10k from a well recognized University for both programs). Since I’ll be 9-11, would a MPA/MPP be pointless and instead I should elect for the Masters in Management?
Endless Summer  
#8 Posted : Sunday, May 17, 2020 1:21:52 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
Thanks for the replies everyone. Many factors in why I want to move to Houston, but it is definitely something I’d like to do down the line. I can understand not doing a Masters since promotion potential is 9-11, but financially it would cost little to nothing (talking at most 10k from a well recognized University for both programs). Since I’ll be 9-11, would a MPA/MPP be pointless and instead I should elect for the Masters in Management?


I think most of us who are 30-40 years down the road from you would say that the things we wanted at 25 are totally different from the things we value now. My point is to look at the Fed position as a stepping stone, to satisfy your needs for the next 3-5 years. Once you are an 11, you start applying for the 12 positions and go where they take you, same for the hop to 13. Unless you have special circumstances you can take that job in DC if it sets you up for the next leap.

As for education, if it gives you an entry, that's great, but experience is what will get you the next bump up.

good luck
senpainft  
#9 Posted : Sunday, May 17, 2020 1:31:28 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Endless Summer Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
Thanks for the replies everyone. Many factors in why I want to move to Houston, but it is definitely something I’d like to do down the line. I can understand not doing a Masters since promotion potential is 9-11, but financially it would cost little to nothing (talking at most 10k from a well recognized University for both programs). Since I’ll be 9-11, would a MPA/MPP be pointless and instead I should elect for the Masters in Management?


I think most of us who are 30-40 years down the road from you would say that the things we wanted at 25 are totally different from the things we value now. My point is to look at the Fed position as a stepping stone, to satisfy your needs for the next 3-5 years. Once you are an 11, you start applying for the 12 positions and go where they take you, same for the hop to 13. Unless you have special circumstances you can take that job in DC if it sets you up for the next leap.

As for education, if it gives you an entry, that's great, but experience is what will get you the next bump up.

good luck


This is the answer I was looking for! thank you. So basically whatever Masters I get is going to be irrelevant in Public, so it would be smartest to get it in Management if I ever want to go private. And you are saying basically what my dad has told me; follow the money don’t let it follow you. I think I know now what I need to do!

frankgonzalez  
#10 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 5:12:53 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: djp Go to Quoted Post
Why do you want yo go to Houston?

You can put in 3 yrs of service and earn status, leave, the come back to feds later.

In Houston there aren’t any big federal presence except for the oil and minerals area under interior dept minerals mamagrmrnt service.

Like other large citues they have
Federal courts
Social security
VA hospital
Some military base
National weather service office
Airport jobs
Some cities have some agency area or regional office.

Houston has one of the highest pay rates in the country

Houston has oil company hqs so oil industry regulatory jobs are likely in Houston along with gulf coast drilling regulatory agencies.
Of course, you forget USCG, NASA (Remember, Mission Control for ISS is there) and a few other agencies.

You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
djp  
#11 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 8:02:29 AM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: someoldguy Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
A Masters in Management is, the best way i could put it, like a junior MBA. Whereas an MBA is usually closer to age 30, a MiM is closer to age 20. You don’t need work experience for it, like you do an MBA program
Yeah my friends who did high-powered MBA's had to have work experience before applying.

Here's a fun fact: for some reason Houston has one of the highest locality pay rates in the nation. Who knows why. I know some people who love Houston and wouldn't want to live anywhere else. Can't say I share the fascination....



Oil and off shore drilling companies have HQ in Houston so local market dynamics pkay a role. You also have federal regulatory offices here where you want to attract some who know the industry to the fed side.

djp  
#12 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 8:23:20 AM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: frankgonzalez Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: djp Go to Quoted Post
Why do you want yo go to Houston?

You can put in 3 yrs of service and earn status, leave, the come back to feds later.

In Houston there aren’t any big federal presence except for the oil and minerals area under interior dept minerals mamagrmrnt service.

Like other large citues they have
Federal courts
Social security
VA hospital
Some military base
National weather service office
Airport jobs
Some cities have some agency area or regional office.

Houston has one of the highest pay rates in the country

Houston has oil company hqs so oil industry regulatory jobs are likely in Houston along with gulf coast drilling regulatory agencies.
Of course, you forget USCG, NASA (Remember, Mission Control for ISS is there) and a few other agencies.



Yes there are other jobs that are common in local area like coast guard near water or large customs and immigration near borders.

With NASA...they generally use different hiring avenues than usajobs to recruit and they are heavy PhD level jobs. It’s not a place an avg person can work for beyond universal job series like admin support, budget, IT support.

NASA has also downsized with shuttle retirement and a move toward contractor employment so the civilian jobs are high management jobs who oversee contracts.

OhD level jobs in the fed govt are not that common.

NASA has a lot
Other agencies have research groups that bring in phDs. Some of them are dual university positions.
Medical Doctors are only found in VHA, Indian health service, and public health commission Corp jobs. In military most doctors are active duty.
NSF science jobs are generally term jobs not permanent. Thus is true in many research jobs that they are term jobs.

Army corps of engineers is one of the few agencies that use engineers to do things that aren’t regulatory or inspection related jobs.

PhD level work in survey design and sampling work is one place where feds are competitive or leaders on a national level. There are other companies that do this. Same true with weather service jobs.



frankgonzalez  
#13 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 9:21:04 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: djp Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: frankgonzalez Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: djp Go to Quoted Post
Why do you want yo go to Houston?

You can put in 3 yrs of service and earn status, leave, the come back to feds later.

In Houston there aren’t any big federal presence except for the oil and minerals area under interior dept minerals mamagrmrnt service.

Like other large citues they have
Federal courts
Social security
VA hospital
Some military base
National weather service office
Airport jobs
Some cities have some agency area or regional office.

Houston has one of the highest pay rates in the country

Houston has oil company hqs so oil industry regulatory jobs are likely in Houston along with gulf coast drilling regulatory agencies.
Of course, you forget USCG, NASA (Remember, Mission Control for ISS is there) and a few other agencies.



Yes there are other jobs that are common in local area like coast guard near water or large customs and immigration near borders.

With NASA...they generally use different hiring avenues than usajobs to recruit and they are heavy PhD level jobs. It’s not a place an avg person can work for beyond universal job series like admin support, budget, IT support.

NASA has also downsized with shuttle retirement and a move toward contractor employment so the civilian jobs are high management jobs who oversee contracts.

OhD level jobs in the fed govt are not that common.

NASA has a lot
Other agencies have research groups that bring in phDs. Some of them are dual university positions.
Medical Doctors are only found in VHA, Indian health service, and public health commission Corp jobs. In military most doctors are active duty.
NSF science jobs are generally term jobs not permanent. Thus is true in many research jobs that they are term jobs.

Army corps of engineers is one of the few agencies that use engineers to do things that aren’t regulatory or inspection related jobs.

PhD level work in survey design and sampling work is one place where feds are competitive or leaders on a national level. There are other companies that do this. Same true with weather service jobs.



Well...NASA uses USAJOBS to hire. While we may reach out via other venues (such as LinkedIn) we send folks over to USAJOBS to apply.

As for the Shuttle mission ending...we still have the ISS, and we are beginning to launch people from US soil once again. Still plenty of NASA civil servants...from GS4-SES across the US. And at Johnson Space Center in Houston, Mission Control is a 24/7 operation with primary and back-up teams for all shifts. They also train the astronauts there.

As for the Coast Guard, they have some regional and district offices there in Houston overseeing a wide range of missions across a large chunk of the country.
You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
TheRealOrange  
#14 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 10:44:26 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Unknown007 Go to Quoted Post
FrankGonzalez has no experience in the federal government. This guy is a fake pretending to be a federal employee under the name of FrankGonzalez. The best advice you can get is from your colleagues at work, friends, and family, beware frank is a HOAX.

A quick Google search shows that he works at NASA as the Conflict Management and Resolution Manager in the Office of Equal Opportunity and Diversity Management. I don't think he's ever hidden his identity.

https://blogs.nasa.gov/odeo/?s=gonzalez
frankgonzalez  
#15 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 11:12:38 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Unknown007 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: TheRealOrange Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Unknown007 Go to Quoted Post
FrankGonzalez has no experience in the federal government. This guy is a fake pretending to be a federal employee under the name of FrankGonzalez. The best advice you can get is from your colleagues at work, friends, and family, beware frank is a HOAX.

A quick Google search shows that he works at NASA as the Conflict Management and Resolution Manager in the Office of Equal Opportunity and Diversity Management. I don't think he's ever hidden his identity.

https://blogs.nasa.gov/odeo/?s=gonzalez


You spam bots are sure annoying by stealing other people identity. If its really him, maybe I should report Frank to his supervisor for his unprofessional conduct towards me and share his post as well. Not worth it those, as this guy is a fake.
Unprofessional? Could explain why you haven't been able to land a job. You talk about defamation lawsuits, but fail to realize threatening someone's work could land you into legal issues.

As for who I am, unlike YOU, I am who I say I am...no fake name needed as I give my opinion based on my experience and qualifications earned over a decade as a civil servant climbing slowly up the ladder to my current position (across 3 agencies), and 22+ years of active duty. I do not hide where I work, and have shared my work email with folks here to advise on resumes, and the federal hiring process.

Of course, I also don't claim to be an employee followed by another post claiming to be a former employee trying to get back in the system...and so on. So...you can ignore my posts if they don't help you...but you calling me a hoax IS defamation of character as my screen-name here is my real name...and I have enough posts where I say where I work, I can prove the two are the same...and so your defaming comments are actionable...if I thought it worth pursuing.

You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
senpainft  
#16 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 11:15:09 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Unknown007 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: TheRealOrange Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Unknown007 Go to Quoted Post
FrankGonzalez has no experience in the federal government. This guy is a fake pretending to be a federal employee under the name of FrankGonzalez. The best advice you can get is from your colleagues at work, friends, and family, beware frank is a HOAX.

A quick Google search shows that he works at NASA as the Conflict Management and Resolution Manager in the Office of Equal Opportunity and Diversity Management. I don't think he's ever hidden his identity.

https://blogs.nasa.gov/odeo/?s=gonzalez


You spam bots are sure annoying by stealing other people identity. If its really him, maybe I should report Frank to his supervisor for his unprofessional conduct towards me and share his post as well. Not worth it those, as this guy is a fake.


Here you go! The attention you’re blatantly seeking.
frankgonzalez  
#17 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 11:56:13 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Unknown007 Go to Quoted Post
Lol someone crying like a baby, do you need your pacifier?

It's not my fault when I post a question, the same folks come to my thread and harass me. If you dont like my post, dont respond. My questions were never directed to you guys regarding nepotism, representation the gov, and waste and abuse. You got upset me for asking what I experience at work. Then your forum buddies go ahead and threaten my career. Then a guy from federalsoup stalking me on reddit, known as agilebutton.

Its 10x worth what your forum buddy Endless Summer did by accusing me of being bennyg, who made terroristic threats on here.

Maybe you guys should have treated me with respect from the beginning. It turns out it's fun being an azzhole :)

Crashing threads is my 2nd career, just like you did to me :)
Nope...projecting much, Unknown0007?

So far, you have asked a question, I responded and pointed out that you were not referred because you failed to show you had the relevant experience at the appropriate level and that would be an issue with your resume.

You have made various claims that are not consistent...are you are fed employee, not a fed employee, was once a fed employee or what?

You have threatened people here with defamation of character claims...yet, when it was explained what was needed for those to be actionable...you then committed the offense you accused others of, even after I explained it would be easy to connect my account name here with who I am off-line.

If you are not bennyg, your descent in your anger and attacks would not help your defense in that denial. It wouldn't be the first time someone has had multiple sock puppet accounts here...one calm troll, casually push buttons with plausible deniability and another posting scat and other insults until they forget to log out of one account before posting again as the "other" sock puppet...resulting in both accounts getting locked.

SO...if you are not Bennyg, perhaps not attacking posters after they answer your questions or using other people's questions to post your attacks on others...like Bennyg has done...is your best approach.

You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
old fed  
#18 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 4:11:38 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Unknown007 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: frankgonzalez Go to Quoted Post
Nope...projecting much, Unknown0007?

So far, you have asked a question, I responded and pointed out that you were not referred because you failed to show you had the relevant experience at the appropriate level and that would be an issue with your resume.


Shows how much of a dummy you are without seeing my resume. If you have read my resume, where is the facts over your bull*****t response?

Originally Posted by: frankgonzalez Go to Quoted Post
You have threatened people here with defamation of character claims...yet, when it was explained what was needed for those to be actionable...you then committed the offense you accused others of, even after I explained it would be easy to connect my account name here with who I am off-line.


Just remember it's you guys that continue to follow my thread, and post jackazz responses. Its the same as harassing someone in person, when they have asked to repeatedly stop it. I never threatened anyone, you guys are the who threaten me by going after my career for questions that wasnt pertaining to you guys. Then your friend Endless Summer, accusing me of being bennyg.

Originally Posted by: frankgonzalez Go to Quoted Post
If you are not bennyg, your descent in your anger and attacks would not help your defense in that denial. It wouldn't be the first time someone has had multiple sock puppet accounts here...one calm troll, casually push buttons with plausible deniability and another posting scat and other insults until they forget to log out of one account before posting again as the "other" sock puppet...resulting in both accounts getting locked.

SO...if you are not Bennyg, perhaps not attacking posters after they answer your questions or using other people's questions to post your attacks on others...like Bennyg has done...is your best approach.


Go ahead be my guest accuse me, see who will be explaining this to the judge.

Yes I have a lawyer, since one of you guys from here is stalking me on Reddit.


ok

djp  
#19 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 7:10:46 PM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Endless Summer Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
Thanks for the replies everyone. Many factors in why I want to move to Houston, but it is definitely something I’d like to do down the line. I can understand not doing a Masters since promotion potential is 9-11, but financially it would cost little to nothing (talking at most 10k from a well recognized University for both programs). Since I’ll be 9-11, would a MPA/MPP be pointless and instead I should elect for the Masters in Management?


I think most of us who are 30-40 years down the road from you would say that the things we wanted at 25 are totally different from the things we value now. My point is to look at the Fed position as a stepping stone, to satisfy your needs for the next 3-5 years. Once you are an 11, you start applying for the 12 positions and go where they take you, same for the hop to 13. Unless you have special circumstances you can take that job in DC if it sets you up for the next leap.

As for education, if it gives you an entry, that's great, but experience is what will get you the next bump up.

good luck


This is the answer I was looking for! thank you. So basically whatever Masters I get is going to be irrelevant in Public, so it would be smartest to get it in Management if I ever want to go private. And you are saying basically what my dad has told me; follow the money don’t let it follow you. I think I know now what I need to do!



Masters does matter in some fields but it’s a masters in a certain area. Not just having a masters.

A masters in management sounds utterly useless.

senpainft  
#20 Posted : Monday, May 18, 2020 8:19:21 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: djp Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Endless Summer Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: senpainft Go to Quoted Post
Thanks for the replies everyone. Many factors in why I want to move to Houston, but it is definitely something I’d like to do down the line. I can understand not doing a Masters since promotion potential is 9-11, but financially it would cost little to nothing (talking at most 10k from a well recognized University for both programs). Since I’ll be 9-11, would a MPA/MPP be pointless and instead I should elect for the Masters in Management?


I think most of us who are 30-40 years down the road from you would say that the things we wanted at 25 are totally different from the things we value now. My point is to look at the Fed position as a stepping stone, to satisfy your needs for the next 3-5 years. Once you are an 11, you start applying for the 12 positions and go where they take you, same for the hop to 13. Unless you have special circumstances you can take that job in DC if it sets you up for the next leap.

As for education, if it gives you an entry, that's great, but experience is what will get you the next bump up.

good luck


This is the answer I was looking for! thank you. So basically whatever Masters I get is going to be irrelevant in Public, so it would be smartest to get it in Management if I ever want to go private. And you are saying basically what my dad has told me; follow the money don’t let it follow you. I think I know now what I need to do!



Masters does matter in some fields but it’s a masters in a certain area. Not just having a masters.

A masters in management sounds utterly useless.


So you would recommend the MPA with a focus in either Public Finance or Public Health something along those lines?
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