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Nerdles  
#1 Posted : Friday, July 31, 2020 3:09:44 AM(UTC)

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I'm a current Fed and have a friend in the private sector who's likely going to get an offer of her first-ever GS position from a federal agency (not mine).

Her current salary is a few thousand higher than step 10 of the grade. Can HR find a way to meet her current salary?

I believe Retained Rate (step 00) is only for current Feds. But maybe Highly Qualified Expert?

She wants the job for the stability and benefits but would prefer not to take a pay cut.

Thanks for any help.
frankgonzalez  
#2 Posted : Friday, July 31, 2020 5:22:34 AM(UTC)
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Without knowing what grade she is starting at, perhaps she needs to look at the total compensation package: Retirement (what does her current position offer for pension, 401K, FEHB etc and compare that to the FERS, TSP, etc), the medical and vacation she gets now vs what civil service offers (and she can try to negotiate leave...perhaps they will credit her 3 years and start her at 6 hr a pay period) and so on. She may find those more than balance out a few $k a year.

Also, once in the system, she only needs 52 weeks to apply for promotions.
You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
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Nerdles on 7/31/2020(UTC)
nembamike  
#3 Posted : Friday, July 31, 2020 5:38:57 AM(UTC)

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Feds will try and bring her on at step 1. She can try and negotiate more based on current salary. As previous poster says look at total package. Stability to me is huge.
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Nerdles on 8/2/2020(UTC)
DaVinci95  
#4 Posted : Friday, July 31, 2020 5:46:27 AM(UTC)
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She could also ask about a recruitment bonus to cover the difference at least for the first year. Long term she’ll need to apply for higher grade positions to get back up to (and beyond) her current salary.
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Nerdles on 8/2/2020(UTC)
djp  
#5 Posted : Friday, July 31, 2020 11:05:26 AM(UTC)

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As s new Fed she can negotiste what step to enter at.

I’m assuming she lives where the job is thus cost of living is comparable.

The most she coukd begotiste is step 10.

Another factor...is this a flat level or ladder?

If she takes any recruitment offer she can’t apply after 1 yr. incentives care term with them.

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Nerdles on 8/2/2020(UTC)
Nerdles  
#6 Posted : Friday, July 31, 2020 1:10:09 PM(UTC)

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Thank you all for the replies.

She's aware of the solid bennies (which is why she applied in the first place despite the lower stated salary range), but obviously anyone would prefer not to take a pay cut if possible. So Highly Qualified Expert is not an option?

Great suggestions on leave accrual and recruitment bonus. I'll pass those along.

Thanks again, all.

Edited by user Friday, July 31, 2020 1:52:17 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

FS0201  
#7 Posted : Saturday, August 1, 2020 12:39:41 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Nerdles Go to Quoted Post
Thank you all for the replies.

She's aware of the solid bennies (which is why she applied in the first place despite the lower stated salary range), but obviously anyone would prefer not to take a pay cut if possible. So Highly Qualified Expert is not an option?

Great suggestions on leave accrual and recruitment bonus. I'll pass those along.

Thanks again, all.


What grade level is the position?
The excuse of, "I read it on FederalSoup..." won't work. Please do your due diligence.
Nerdles  
#8 Posted : Saturday, August 1, 2020 12:54:49 PM(UTC)

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GS-12
FrankJr  
#9 Posted : Sunday, August 2, 2020 7:07:53 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Nerdles Go to Quoted Post
I'm a current Fed and have a friend in the private sector who's likely going to get an offer of her first-ever GS position from a federal agency (not mine).

Her current salary is a few thousand higher than step 10 of the grade. Can HR find a way to meet her current salary?

I believe Retained Rate (step 00) is only for current Feds. But maybe Highly Qualified Expert?

She wants the job for the stability and benefits but would prefer not to take a pay cut.

Thanks for any help.


HR may or may not meet the current salary, but starting as a GS12 step 10+ provides little opportunity for increases in pay. The GS12 step 10+ exceeds the GS13 step 6. Unless the goal is to leverage the federal public sector job into a future higher paying private sector job the money issue is going to be an issue. Lots of unhappy federal employees tapped out at step 10 with no where to go.
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Nerdles on 8/2/2020(UTC)
Nerdles  
#10 Posted : Sunday, August 2, 2020 7:59:44 AM(UTC)

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Thanks, Frank. I don't think that's her intention at all (to someday return to the private sector). I've made the case that the stability of federal employment is likely woth a near-term pay cut (I believe in her case around 5K), and I think I'm pretty persuasive.

At the same time, I want to see her get the best deal she can within the confines of the regs (as any friend would), by at least minimizing the drop in family income. Thanks again!
FS0201  
#11 Posted : Sunday, August 2, 2020 9:23:22 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Nerdles Go to Quoted Post
GS-12


Trying for a higher leave accrual rate would be wise. While I would typically recommend management against granting it, it is certainly worthwhile if she is able to get it. I have seen selectees get 8 hours, but those were primarily in hard to fill positions/locations.

A 5k loss, considering the overall benefit package, ability to apply for higher grades after 52 weeks, and stability of federal employment is no significant.
The excuse of, "I read it on FederalSoup..." won't work. Please do your due diligence.
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Nerdles on 8/2/2020(UTC)
Nerdles  
#12 Posted : Sunday, August 2, 2020 10:04:03 AM(UTC)

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Good advice, thanks. I will advise asking for 6 hours per PP assuming they can't meet current salary. Seems fair, costs the agency nothing in the short term, and they do it for veterans all the time, at least at my agency.
ninem  
#13 Posted : Sunday, August 2, 2020 11:25:32 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: FrankJr Go to Quoted Post

HR may or may not meet the current salary, but starting as a GS12 step 10+ provides little opportunity for increases in pay. The GS12 step 10+ exceeds the GS13 step 6. Unless the goal is to leverage the federal public sector job into a future higher paying private sector job the money issue is going to be an issue. Lots of unhappy federal employees tapped out at step 10 with no where to go.


Sorry just have to chime in here. This sounds like how some people turn down a pay increase because it will put them in a higher tax bracket, not understanding how progressive tax brackets work

There is truly no scenario in which it is better for this person to come in below step 10, assuming they are afforded the chance to come in at 10. Even if they have no more room to increase pay besides applying to higher grades after a year, that is still year(s) they will be making more money, versus what? Making less, but somehow feeling better about getting gradual step increases just to end up where they could have started?


Originally Posted by: Nerdles Go to Quoted Post
Good advice, thanks. I will advise asking for 6 hours per PP assuming they can't meet current salary. Seems fair, costs the agency nothing in the short term, and they do it for veterans all the time, at least at my agency.



Please have your friend ask for all 3:

Step 10, based on their current pay
Leave group 2 (6 hr/period) based on X years of relevant private sector experience, assuming they have 3+ years
Hiring incentive (equivalent of private sector sign-on bonus). The highest I was ever able to negotiate was 15k for a GS-14 position and 12k for a GS-13 position

They can say yes to all 3, they can say no to all 3. Your friend should go for it and might end up pleasantly surprised
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Nerdles on 8/2/2020(UTC)
Nerdles  
#14 Posted : Sunday, August 2, 2020 11:47:55 AM(UTC)

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@Ninem thanks for weighing in. I agree, can't hurt to ask. I was going to suggest she start off asking for salary match and then (when they can only offer step 10) asking for 6 hours and a recruitment bonus. I figure no one likes saying No over and over if someone is asking nicely and the request is reasonable.
frankgonzalez  
#15 Posted : Monday, August 3, 2020 3:58:49 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Nerdles Go to Quoted Post
Good advice, thanks. I will advise asking for 6 hours per PP assuming they can't meet current salary. Seems fair, costs the agency nothing in the short term, and they do it for veterans all the time, at least at my agency.
Not the same comparison. A veteran's ability to get credit for leave is based in statute, not a negotiation (unless they are retired, and then the vet's options are more limited).

Her negotiation should focus on her years of experience in the field, etc and not do any comparison to veterans (which will be a losing argument).



You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
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smithandjones on 8/3/2020(UTC), Nerdles on 8/3/2020(UTC)
ninem  
#16 Posted : Monday, August 3, 2020 11:42:15 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: frankgonzalez Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Nerdles Go to Quoted Post
Good advice, thanks. I will advise asking for 6 hours per PP assuming they can't meet current salary. Seems fair, costs the agency nothing in the short term, and they do it for veterans all the time, at least at my agency.
Not the same comparison. A veteran's ability to get credit for leave is based in statute, not a negotiation (unless they are retired, and then the vet's options are more limited).

Her negotiation should focus on her years of experience in the field, etc and not do any comparison to veterans (which will be a losing argument).






Agreed 100%

It would also make sense to ask for everything at once. The reason being, the higher the step being asked for, the longer it takes to go up the chain for approval. Step 10 approval can take a month or longer. Unless you purposely want to delay the offer, just try to negotiate everything up front. You don't need a long-winded email or justification:


"Based on my current salary of $$$, I would like to request step #. I have attached two recent pay stubs as confirmation.

I would like to request # years credited towards my service comp date, based on my private sector experience relevant to this position, as reflected in my resume."

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frankgonzalez on 8/3/2020(UTC), Nerdles on 8/3/2020(UTC)
Nerdles  
#17 Posted : Monday, August 3, 2020 2:48:49 PM(UTC)

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Frank G, copy that; thank you. Hadn't thought of that.

Ninem, my reasoning was that over the phone with HR (my recommendation), she could ask first about salary match and then (assuming that's a no) in the same discussion ask for step 10 and the 6-hour accrual.

Tell me if I'm wrong, but I figured that on the phone, her courtesy and humility will come through, vs the,risk of losing tone in email, which could be misread as a list of demands. Plus email is easier to ignore versus someone on the line who's asking politely.
FS0201  
#18 Posted : Monday, August 3, 2020 4:48:26 PM(UTC)
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I would send an email. Requesting verbally might carry more weight, but it is likely that she will be speaking with a staffer, not the person who will make the decision (even the selecting official is likely not the final say.). Using email ensures that there is no confusion on what is being requested, and allows for the supporting documentation to be included at same time.

Your friend should be prepared for the hiring manager/decision maker to not be willing to give all or even any of what is requested. While she may be a stellar candidate, it is likely there are several more within reach.
The excuse of, "I read it on FederalSoup..." won't work. Please do your due diligence.
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Nerdles on 8/3/2020(UTC)
Nerdles  
#19 Posted : Tuesday, August 4, 2020 1:59:49 AM(UTC)

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FS0201, thanks. That makes sense.
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