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Relocating

Are you considering relocating your federal career - either by your choice or by Uncle Sam? There are practical issues and concerns to think about when deciding whether or not to relocate. Others have done it while still others have not. This forum will allow for all to offer their insight, post their questions, and help each other out.

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Shastin  
#1 Posted : Monday, September 27, 2021 2:51:58 PM(UTC)
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Hello all, looking for assistance/guidance on my issue. I am currently 10 months into tour OCONUS, me and my spouse are terrifically unhappy with current work arrangements. I started looking in august for new jobs CONUS, got a tentative but, they are insisting that I start 10/24, pending my firm offer once current command signs my curtailment. I honestly thought it would take 6 months to get started if anyone picked me up in august, so this was a surprise.

so problem is, my technical director has told me that I am going to be 100% liable for the PCS costs that moved me OCONUS (of which, I have not been given a number, but I imagine it to be quite steep)

I am fully aware that I will accept that costs to move CONUS since I am not staying the full 24 months, but I disagree that I should be liable for costs to OCONUS because according to my transportation agreement, my commitment was 12 months government service, and since my new position is still within government, shouldn't that still satisfy the Transportation Agreement?

despite pointing that out, I have been asked to provide evidence that suggests I am correct. Can anyone help me with exact quotes that will help me out here?

also, I've heard that when someone leaves early (even if its not within government) they are pro rated for their service and simply owe their prorated amount. In this instance that would be 2/12ths, which as a worst case scenario, I could live with, but I need to present findings as evidence. Can anyone here provide solid data and exact locations in the JTR on either of these scenarios? I would be very grateful, and my head is spinning reading the JTR


thanks so much in advance for your time and attention!
0018 Hopeful  
#2 Posted : Tuesday, September 28, 2021 12:48:11 PM(UTC)
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You have to do 12 months.

It is a thing.

OCONUS with Corona has got to be tough.
0018 Hopeful  
#3 Posted : Tuesday, September 28, 2021 12:51:19 PM(UTC)
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12 months to not have to pay your to "Europe or Asia" cost.

Look up DOD Transfer Manual.
0018 Hopeful  
#4 Posted : Tuesday, September 28, 2021 1:16:08 PM(UTC)
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https://www.acq.osd.mil/...sRegs/Pubs/jftr_vol2.pdf

JTR is where you need to look.

Not looking good for you.
Shastin  
#5 Posted : Tuesday, September 28, 2021 1:39:36 PM(UTC)
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so, my transportation agreement says that I am indebted to government service for 12 months, am I violating the transportation agreement even though I am remaining in government service just switching agencies?

also, people here at my HR told me that in these situations people usually get their debt pro rated, does anyone have any information about that?
Shastin  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, September 28, 2021 1:45:33 PM(UTC)
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also, could anyone tell me how I might find out what my pcs costs were?

I've spoken to HR, they dont know, and neither does personal property.
0018 Hopeful  
#7 Posted : Wednesday, September 29, 2021 4:47:32 PM(UTC)
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Yes you are violating your transportation agreement by doing less than 12 months.

Talk to JAG where you are about it.
Endless Summer  
#8 Posted : Sunday, October 3, 2021 4:19:00 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: 0018 Hopeful Go to Quoted Post
Yes you are violating your transportation agreement by doing less than 12 months.

Talk to JAG where you are about it.


No, this is not correct. You will not be in violation. Since I'm lazy I won't retype my story but you can find it here...

https://forum.federalsou...s&t=87257#post968501

I was in exactly the same sitiation. I PCS'd after six months in and owe nothing as I've met my 12 month obligation. The base CO issued a letter releasing me from any financial obligation after I provided multiple references to relevant findings by the CBCA.

The JAG was no help, they told me they do not get involved in personnel matters and it was unnecessary after I discovered the CBCA.
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Shastin on 10/4/2021(UTC)
Shastin  
#9 Posted : Monday, October 4, 2021 1:28:51 PM(UTC)
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Endless_summer
first let me say how much I appreciate you sharing that website, amazing that that resource hasn't been presented to me until now.

2nd, I was wondering if you had a case that you were able to use as a reference? or what resources you used to contest with your agency? I've looked at all relocation cases for the last 4 years and have not found one about an early tour curtailment.

anything further is greatly appreciated, thank you!
Endless Summer  
#10 Posted : Monday, October 4, 2021 3:15:03 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Shastin Go to Quoted Post
Endless_summer
..
2nd, I was wondering if you had a case that you were able to use as a reference? or what resources you used to contest with your agency? I've looked at all relocation cases for the last 4 years and have not found one about an early tour curtailment.

anything further is greatly appreciated, thank you!


I think it's your search term, try using "12 month government service", "transportation agreement" etc.

If you decide to file, there are very good instructions on the CBCA site and the process is rather simple.

But, here are the references I cited to my command. When I sent the attached and let them know I was prepared to file they got back to me almost immediately .You should be able to search for the ruling by CBCA ###...

APPLICABLE STATUTES, REGULATIONS, AND CASES
CBCA 460-RELO MARILYN FOURNIER (2007) The Civilian Board of Contract Appeals stated:
In deciding whether an agency could by agreement require a transferred employee to remain in the service of a specific agency, rather than simply in Government service, the United States Court of Claims explored the meaning of the term “Government service”:

The statute is clear and unambiguous on its face; however, we note from its legislative history that the requirement for remaining in Federal service was submitted in a report by the Bureau of the Budget which reads in part as follows:
In order to assure that the moving expenses are not paid to employees who do not intend to continue working for the Government after they have been moved, the bill provides that employees must agree in writing to remain in Government service for at least 1 year after they have moved . . . .
. . . .
Section 5721(4) [of title 5 U.S.C.] for the purpose of the subchapter and of § 5724(i) defines “Government” to mean the Government of the United States; a fortiori, to remain in “Government service” requires only that the employee remain in the service of the Government of the United States for twelve months after his transfer.

GSBCA 16612-RELO NANCY C. JOHNSON (2005) the GSA Board of Contract Appeals found that:
As CIFA recognizes, both the statute and the service agreement require only that Dr. Johnson remain in government service for twelve months after her transfer, and that Dr. Johnson's transfer to the Capitol Police does not violate either the statute or the express terms of the agreement. Finn v. United States, 428 F.2d 828 (Ct. Cl. 1970)

CBCA 1710-RELO EDWARD C WOLAHAN (2010) the Civilian Board of Contract Appeals held that
The service agreement concerns only the situation in which an employee transfers but leaves government service within twelve months of the move. ...

Finn v. United States, 428 F.2d 828, 831-32 (Ct. Cl. 1970).
Section 5721(4), for the purpose of the subchapter and of § 5724(i) defines "Government" to mean the Government of the United States; a fortiori, to remain in "Government service" requires only that the employee remain in the service of the Government of the United States for twelve months after his transfer. This is the limit of the contractual authority granted an agency under the statute, and the agency cannot by contract further limit a transferred employee to "agency service" as contrasted to "Government service." Within the purview and intent of this statute, Congress clearly did not intend that "Government service" was to be regarded as synonymous with "agency service."

THE JOINT TRAVEL REGULATIONS (JTR) p. 5G 13 (2020)
Acceptable Reasons for Release from a Tour of Duty

C. Released to Continue Employment. A civilian employee, serving under a service agreement who transfers to another DoD Component or Agency, must be released from the tour of duty requirement in the civilian employee’s current agreement, unless transferring to another DoD Component within 12 months of reporting to the PDS on a PCS move (see par. 053706-A). If the transfer involves PCS allowances to a new PDS, the gaining activity is responsible for all PCS costs. The civilian employee must continue in Government service for at least 12 months after he or she reported at the PDS where departing to satisfy the obligation for costs incurred by the losing activity in moving the civilian employee to that PDS.
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Shastin on 10/5/2021(UTC)
Shastin  
#11 Posted : Tuesday, October 5, 2021 2:33:43 AM(UTC)
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Endless Summer, I owe you a cofee/beer. I will investigate everything you've provided me further and again want to sincerely thank you for all of your help.

just for the sake of chat at this point, I protested my commands decision with the examples below, and was still told they would collect if I left.

"5844 ACCEPTABLE REASONS FOR RELEASE FROM A TOUR OF DUTY
C. Transfer to Other Departments/Agencies
1. Except as indicated in par. 5502-C, an employee, serving under a service
agreement who transfers to another DoD component/Gov’t agency, must be
released from the tour of duty requirement specified in the employee's current
agreement.
2. If the transfer involves PCS allowances to a new PDS, the gaining activity is
responsible for all PCS costs.
3. The employee must continue in Gov’t service for at least 12 months after the
employee reported at the PDS from which departing to satisfy the obligation for
costs incurred by the losing activity in moving the employee to that PDS.

Examples of violations 2014JTR:
Ch 5: Permanent Duty Travel
Part B: Civilian Employees Only/Sec 11e: Service Agreements (Agreement
Violation)
5846-5858
2. Example 2.
An employee at PDS A signs a 12-month service agreement.

a. After serving 6 months, the employee is authorized a PCS to PDS B,
and signs a new 12-month service agreement.

b. The employee serves 7 months at PDS B and then resigns.

c. The total service at PDSs A and B is 13 months.

d. The 12-month service requirement under the service agreement
relating to PDS A is satisfied and there is no liability for travel to PDS A.
e. The employee is, however, financially responsible for the travel and
transportation cost and related allowances paid for travel from PDS A to
PDS B."
Endless Summer  
#12 Posted : Tuesday, October 5, 2021 6:38:25 AM(UTC)
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OK, I hope I haven't misunderdstood your original question.

My comments refer only to PCS costs to get you to your current command. Those are the ones with the requirement for 12 months government service, otherwise you must reimburse.

PCS costs back CONUS are an entirely different matter. I am assuming you signed form DD 1617, which contains the following clauses, note that the requirements of clause "a" which deals with return PCS are completely different than clause "b" which deals with the original PCS costs.

Clause "a" does require you to remain in your current billet for the agree upon term in order for your current command to pay return PCS costs.

If you take another Fed job, you must either pay your own return PCS costs or take a job with PCS paid.

Your command is bluffing, just like mine was. I let it be known that I was filing with the CBCA and I would also file a FOIA request to find out how many others they had cheated out of their PCS funds. It ended up being unnecessary, they folded.

"a. When I complete _______ months, the prescribed tour of duty, I will be eligible for return travel and transportation
allowances at Government expense for myself, my dependents, or my household effects, to my actual residence at time of
appointment stated above for purpose of separation from the service, unless separated early for reasons beyond my control
that are acceptable to the agency concerned.

b. I will remain in Government service for at least 12 months beginning with the effective date of my transfer or
appointment to my new OCONUS PDS, unless separated for reasons beyond my control that are acceptable to the agency
concerned. If I fail to remain in service the required minimum period of time, or if I am removed for cause before expiration
of the required minimum period of service, I am obligated and will, upon demand, repay to the Government a sum of money
equivalent to what the Government paid for travel and transportation and related allowances associated with the transfer of
myself and my dependents, e.g., HHG storage and shipment, CONUS temporary quarters subsistence expenses, (but not
OCONUS temporary quarters subsistence allowance), real estate and/or relocation expenses, miscellaneous expenses, and
any other related allowances incident to my transfer, from beginning point of travel to the PDS. The employing Agency may
withhold any final pay due to me to apply against or liquidate any indebtedness arising from a violation of this agreement."
Endless Summer  
#13 Posted : Tuesday, October 5, 2021 6:58:38 AM(UTC)
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To keep that earlier post from getting ridiculously long I'll break it up.

If it helps, this is the letter I had prepared to submit to CBCA. You can replace "(redacted)" with your details. The wording below is based on CBCA guidelines and examples of filings that I found on their website.

Here's how you fire a shot across the *******s' bow. Make sure you cc the senior person at your command who has been denying your request. I'd throw the Unit CO and Base CO in just out of spite.

https://cbca.gov/howto/index.html

“CONSENT TO DISCLOSURE”

This complaint deals with a violation of law, rule, or regulation. Specifically, the implementation and interpretation of the OCONUS Service Agreement (DD-1617) by Department of Army(DA) personnel.

DA and the Civilian Human Resources Agency (CHRA) Far East Region are telling DA Civilians(DAC) that the DD-1617 requires 12 months continuous service to the DA in their current billet. This, as the citations below illustrate, is not the case.

The requirement is that the DAC remain in the Federal Government Service for 12 months after the Transportation agreement comes into effect. The Civilian Board of Contract Appeals and the U.S. Court of Claims have both ruled that the Service Agreement cannot be interpreted to mean that an employee is required to remain in the service of the original agency. Service in any Federal Government Agency will meet the requirement as long as there is no interruption in service.

The Civilian Human Resources Agency (CHRA) Far East Region and my local S1 Chief at the (redacted) have told me that I will be liable to repay the relocation costs.

I ask that DFAS issue guidance clearly explaining the law.

STATEMENT OF FACTS

I was hired by the DA with a start date of (redacted) . DA reimbursed me for relocation costs I incurred and paid travel related benefits and costs on my behalf to move to (redacted) . I signed a service agreement (DD-1617), in which I agreed to remain in the Federal Government Service for twelve months following the effective date of transfer. Failure to do so could result in me being required to repay most of the relocation costs to the Government.

I subsequently accepted a position with a Federal Government Agency, the Department of the (redacted) , six months after the Service Agreement coming into effect, and will relocate to CONUS at (redacted) expense. There will be no break in service between DA and (redacted) .

The DA stated that according to local policies the requirement is for twelve months in the current duty station and billet and I would be in violation if I transferred within the twelve month window.


APPLICABLE STATUTES, REGULATIONS, AND CASES

CBCA 460-RELO MARILYN FOURNIER (2007) The Civilian Board of Contract Appeals stated:
In deciding whether an agency could by agreement require a transferred employee to remain in the service of a specific agency, rather than simply in Government service, the United States Court of Claims explored the meaning of the term “Government service”:

The statute is clear and unambiguous on its face; however, we note from its legislative history that the requirement for remaining in Federal service was submitted in a report by the Bureau of the Budget which reads in part as follows:
In order to assure that the moving expenses are not paid to employees who do not intend to continue working for the Government after they have been moved, the bill provides that employees must agree in writing to remain in Government service for at least 1 year after they have moved . . . .
. . . .
Section 5721(4) [of title 5 U.S.C.] for the purpose of the subchapter and of § 5724(i) defines “Government” to mean the Government of the United States; a fortiori, to remain in “Government service” requires only that the employee remain in the service of the Government of the United States for twelve months after his transfer.

GSBCA 16612-RELO NANCY C. JOHNSON (2005) the GSA Board of Contract Appeals found that:
As CIFA recognizes, both the statute and the service agreement require only that Dr. Johnson remain in government service for twelve months after her transfer, and that Dr. Johnson's transfer to the Capitol Police does not violate either the statute or the express terms of the agreement. Finn v. United States, 428 F.2d 828 (Ct. Cl. 1970)

CBCA 1710-RELO EDWARD C WOLAHAN (2010) the Civilian Board of Contract Appeals held that
The service agreement concerns only the situation in which an employee transfers but leaves government service within twelve months of the move. ...

Finn v. United States, 428 F.2d 828, 831-32 (Ct. Cl. 1970).
Section 5721(4), for the purpose of the subchapter and of § 5724(i) defines "Government" to mean the Government of the United States; a fortiori, to remain in "Government service" requires only that the employee remain in the service of the Government of the United States for twelve months after his transfer. This is the limit of the contractual authority granted an agency under the statute, and the agency cannot by contract further limit a transferred employee to "agency service" as contrasted to "Government service." Within the purview and intent of this statute, Congress clearly did not intend that "Government service" was to be regarded as synonymous with "agency service."

THE JOINT TRAVEL REGULATIONS (JTR) p. 5G 13 (2020)
Acceptable Reasons for Release from a Tour of Duty

C. Released to Continue Employment. A civilian employee, serving under a service agreement who transfers to another DoD Component or Agency, must be released from the tour of duty requirement in the civilian employee’s current agreement, unless transferring to another DoD Component within 12 months of reporting to the PDS on a PCS move (see par. 053706-A). If the transfer involves PCS allowances to a new PDS, the gaining activity is responsible for all PCS costs. The civilian employee must continue in Government service for at least 12 months after he or she reported at the PDS where departing to satisfy the obligation for costs incurred by the losing activity in moving the civilian employee to that PDS.

REQUESTED ACTION

Claimant requests the Board find that the DA has no basis for demanding repayment of Relocation costs from Claimant and instruct DA to abandon its demand. In the event that DA has withheld pay or otherwise collected any monies related to their demand before this case is ruled on, claimant requests the return of those funds.






Respectfully submitted,
icanzz  
#14 Posted : Tuesday, October 5, 2021 8:21:42 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: 0018 Hopeful Go to Quoted Post
https://www.acq.osd.mil/dpap/ccap/cc/jcchb/Files/FormsPubsRegs/Pubs/jftr_vol2.pdf

JTR is where you need to look.

Not looking good for you.


That link might lead to outdated info. see https://www.defensetrave...mil/Docs/perdiem/JTR.pdf checkout pg. 463 or so.

Edited by user Tuesday, October 5, 2021 8:38:07 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

icanzz  
#15 Posted : Tuesday, October 5, 2021 8:37:21 PM(UTC)
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Prorated Prorated Prorated?

Never seen or found anything that says Repayment for 12 month violation can/will/should be Prorated.

But DD Form 1617 and Civilian JTR says Violation is for leaving "Government Service" completely. Not for changing govt. agencies.

Edited by user Tuesday, October 5, 2021 8:38:44 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Endless Summer  
#16 Posted : Wednesday, October 6, 2021 6:11:39 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: icanzz Go to Quoted Post
Prorated Prorated Prorated?

Never seen or found anything that says Repayment for 12 month violation can/will/should be Prorated.

But DD Form 1617 and Civilian JTR says Violation is for leaving "Government Service" completely. Not for changing govt. agencies.


The problem I ran into is that the local command believes that they are entitled to interpret the regulations. That's actually what the HR drone told me, "That's not how we interpret the rule".

So it wouldn't surprise me if someone was making up their own rules about prorating the obligation.

Once the unit Commander gets a phone call from the nice lawyers in DC he'll sort the folks out. If not, his boss will.
icanzz  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, October 6, 2021 6:35:31 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Endless Summer Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: icanzz Go to Quoted Post
Prorated Prorated Prorated?

Never seen or found anything that says Repayment for 12 month violation can/will/should be Prorated.

But DD Form 1617 and Civilian JTR says Violation is for leaving "Government Service" completely. Not for changing govt. agencies.


The problem I ran into is that the local command believes that they are entitled to interpret the regulations. That's actually what the HR drone told me, "That's not how we interpret the rule".

So it wouldn't surprise me if someone was making up their own rules about prorating the obligation.

Once the unit Commander gets a phone call from the nice lawyers in DC he'll sort the folks out. If not, his boss will.


There is an Army DA form 3440, NAF Transportation agreement that states you must do 12 months with an organization and remain at duty location 12 months or pay back PCS money for move. Maybe they are getting it mixed up with DD 1617...?

A person signing DA form 3440 would fall under rules of
Army Regulation 215–3
Morale, Welfare, and Recreation
Nonappropriated Funds Personnel Policy

Edited by user Wednesday, October 6, 2021 6:44:45 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

icanzz  
#18 Posted : Wednesday, October 6, 2021 9:17:06 PM(UTC)
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Tried to copy paste the examples of transportation agreement violations but looked terrible. go to website and click on: CE-CPDT-26.pdf or Microsoft Word - CE-CPDT-01 (02-19-19) <----easier to read.

As far as prorating...JTR and DoD 7000.14-R Financial Management Regulation Volume 9, Chapter 6 says "all" as far paying entitlements back if violation is deemed to have occurred.

Your situation would be "no violation". imo.


https://www.defensetrave...iolation&x=0&y=0

Edited by user Wednesday, October 6, 2021 9:22:11 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

icanzz  
#19 Posted : Thursday, October 7, 2021 7:06:26 PM(UTC)
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I think this question has been put to rest.

BLUF: if you sign a DD1617 OCONUS Transportation agreement and you transfer to another Federal Government position, you DO NOT violate your agreement. Now if you sign some kind of addendum to DD 1617, which I wonder if Locally paid moves (moves paid for directly by gaining agency) vs. Centrally funded moves might include some stipulation, but I have never seen one.

I can understand why a Commander may think they can enforce no movement or receive some kind of reimbursement if you move in the first 12 months if they paid for move out local funds...but they are mistaken or knowingly trying to pull a fast one and hope you won't call them on it.

Edited by user Thursday, October 7, 2021 7:10:03 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Endless Summer on 10/8/2021(UTC)
Endless Summer  
#20 Posted : Friday, October 8, 2021 12:30:41 PM(UTC)
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I hope the OP will come back and let us know how it all played out. I gthink this is a widespread problem that's costing employees many thousands of dollars needlessly.
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